Rojo Next post Ok

Penny

read the above. AMIEU need no lobbying by us.

There is little need to lobby greens.

http://wa.greens.org.au/items/Media_Release.2007-11-08.3547

Penny said
(WA in fact HAS appointed a new government Inspectorate for animal welfare - six General Inspectors, I heard, a lack of confidence in the RSPCA there).

Pale replies
Umm DPI. As I have have explained before RSPCA have a MOU with State Governments DPI.
To me that is to keep others away. People like you and I – not a bonus for Animal Welfare- Sorry.

Penny Said
, I heard, a lack of confidence in the RSPCA there).
Pale replies

Yes- They are rather upset RSPCA broke ranks and publicly insisted the live trade be banned.

Penny said

Tended to rely a little on the Heilbron/Larkins Report and the report by the WA Meat Processing Industry Taskforce (Lindner) report.

Pale replies=Yes I agree however it’s a lot of money only to be ignored-=Like others.

There are probably only a half a dozen blokes left who really understand the meat Industry enough to do it justice. Then you must get them to agree.

Most are tired up with live exports and wont touch it because of conflict of interest [ Or getting fired!]

Perhaps this might interest you=
http://www.livexports.com/davidwoodsreport.html

You are looking at spending reasonable big bucks. However if you can= excellent.

penny said
H "celebrities" is that they can get a bit temperamental.

Penny If you want to impress the Government it must be somebody with that type of back ground. If you include a business plan and feasibility study including chilled or carcass we would be prepared to help towards costs.

After saying that ALP has clearly made promises to the live trade so it’s a hard if not impossible sell.

We are still far better agreeing to speak with farmers and escorting our Saudis to meet them on their farms at grass roots

We will get no help from FF,MLA, Austrade.

we need people to put their hand up to speak with farmers in their state and greet a plane.
Costs nothing.

Rojo said

The 40000 figure has been bandied around, I'd just like to see where it came from. Someone discredited the Hassal report for factoring in "related" jobs, but served this figure up as a given.

Pale replies

Rojo= smile
Yabb` little Shadow- I bet your buddies would like to know. You have more moves than a Swiss watch but that’s ok. Makes it more interesting for me personally.Ok I will save you fishing for that answer any longer and put you all out of your misery.

I am proud to say that someone may be seen below- Just scroll down and see if you think you can spot the culprit ok. If not let me know and I might even post the speech-+ If your good boys= funny as.

http://www.halakindmeats.com/

Rojo said
Previously posted my sources, re: losses. Not my problem if you can't accept figures from a non-live export related field.

Pale replies
Oh come now did you? Well I am terribly sorry I missed that one. Be a darling and re post it for me please.
In will return same with the scoundrel who discredited the Hassal report. Now there’s a good trade deal. I just love doing business with you guys.

Rojo says
Not everything has to be a conspiracy.
Pale replies
That’s what I keep telling your lot= funny.

I will reply to you next paragraph in my nest post.

Rojo said

Several towns in my region once upon a time had an abattoir, now there are only derelict buildings.
Pale replies

Really= always interested of course = Perhaps you could act as an agent and pick half K.
Mind you nothing happens before we source stock from farmers direct=as you would anticipate


Rojo said
interesting point - that no matter how good the conditions on board the ships Because of the "atrocities" at the other end

Pale replies
Yes it is = Just goes to show how smart some Arabs are. They really do leave us for dead.

Makes you wonder why we didn’t think to use Haram to market our product doesn’t it.?

Interestingly the Heilbron report states 10500 "lost" jobs, just over half of the AMIEU's claim. No wonder you are distancing yourself from it.

Rojo and Yabby, you are like two sides of the same coin. In order to understand some of the more complex economics, you need to understand Heilbron's figure of 10,500 relates to direct jobs, not (all of) thw downtream processing, and the jobs in businesses on towns where meat processing was the only, or the major employer. The fragmentation and marginalization of these rural/regional communities is well documented. And Heilbron and Larkins' report is from 2000, which compounds matters further.

Pale, in order for this strategy of yours to work, your Arab friends whom you want people to meet/introduce to farmers would, I suspect, have to be guaranteeing something in terms of price. I suspect that farmers would not even contemplate meeting them otherwise; they are happier loading the hapless animals onto ships and sending them to hell.

Nor do I even begin to subscribe to the industry propaganda that these "experts" (how many experts? In how many countries?) are making a difference that is even remotely significant. The point is that if Australia refused to supply animals on moral/welfare grounds, no other country can supply the volume, and it is about making an example of these people so that other countries will do the same.

Penny, as it happens, economics is one of my strengths. I’ve read these reports,
Most are full of holes, as the economists writing them don’t have a clue about
the complexities of the industry they are studying.

I remind you that most live sheep come from WA, not from NSW, its always been
that way. What knocked NSW around was the fact that Australia now has 85 million
less sheep then it had in the early 90s, due to lack of profitability, drought etc.
So arguing what happened in NSW, when most shippers have always come from
WA, is a waste of time.

Do you think we are going to truck them over there? Well it did happen, when
the Saudi market closed for a while. That is cruel, IMHO.

Now take the Hassel report and work out the value of a sheep FOB Fremantle,
plus its food etc, all bought here. Compare that to the selling price of a sheep
in a box, including all downstream processing. The value of that live sheep
is still well ahead. Our beloved meat exporters are so good at outdiscounting
one another in the marketplace, that buyers just sit back and smile.

Not a single sheep skin is processed in WA, everything is done in China. We
have no labour here. The AMIEU can’t supply any either, ask Rodger Fletcher,
who knows the situation here. We don’t even have the labour to kill half the
animals processed here, let alone another 3 million.

How do you know that people like the Dundons are not making a difference?
Did your little spy go and check for herself, or is that not part of your agenda?

It is Islamic law that animals should be treated kindly. Have you tried to
use that to the advantage of the animals? Religion matters in the ME.

What other countries will do the same? Sudan? China? Somalia?

The problem Penny, its seems to me, is your typically arrogant Western
big stick approach, just like George Bush. You are going to tell these
*ignorant savages* how the cookie crumbles.

tbc

Now I remind you Penny, that right now, Saudi Arabia alone earns one thousand million Dollars a DAY from oil. If you think that with that kind of money, they
can’t go out and buy what they want, with Africa next door, you are dreaming.

In fact one Saudi company, which pulled out of the shipper market as our new
regulations were too tough for them, has switched to shipping cattle from
Africa instead. There are a lot of cattle in Africa and they can be bought,
never mind the sheep, goats, camels etc.

Where I see the problem is that you guys have your fixed little views there,
which are all black and white, based on your philosophies, which are banners
on your websites. You lack people qualified in livestock, as distinct from pets.
You have marketing people, graphics people, all kinds of most likely really
nice people, but with a set, inflexible agenda. You refuse to think outside
the square or to compromise. I don’t think that’s very intelligent.

People in the ME have been living with and eating livestock for a very long
time. If you think that they are just going to rush to listen to your big stick
approach, you know sweet nothing about Arab culture, as the Americans
are now learning fast.

Lots in fact could be done in the ME, to help all animals, not just Australian
animals. But you won’t even compromise or think about these things,
its all just black and white arrogance. That’s what really annoys me.

Your contempt for farmers is obvious and what would really happen on
the ground and the repercussions of that, if the live trade were to shut
tomorrow, you don’t seem to even consider.

Win-win solutions are the way to resolve and solve things, not your
big stick approach. All sides and all people need to be considered.
Its time you thought about that a little, if you claim to be educated.