*I get paid
far more than $20 an hour or $40K, too.*

Well Penny, please show us that you have the intelligence to deserve more, so far I
can’t see it reflected in your posts.

*Euthanasia at sea is a) being thrown over the side for the sharks, possibly alive b) thrown down a macerator, possibly alive*

So Penny, were you on the Becrux or Deneb, to witness all this, or do you just believe what you
read on any website? Did they ask for your donations by the way? Do you understand the orders
under which these guys operate these days?

*Personally, I think that there is a large section of the farming community who probably should be in gaol*

Well there we have it, another ignorant city slicker, who doesn’t know the first thing about farming,
who wants to comment about what they don’t understand. Such is the internet today. Ignorance is
bliss via the internet!

*You are in fact getting peanuts of what you claim to be riches beyond your dreams.*

Ahem, who claimed that? Sounds like its part of your dreams, nobody else.

*at least 150 meat processing plants closed down.*

Yup, lots of plants closed down, especially in NSW. Fact is that the Australian sheep flock
has halved, due to lack of profitability. You go to work, you want to get paid. Why should
farmers be any different?

Penny, it would really be great if you informed yourself a bit, before commenting. So far that’s
simply not been the case.

Yabby, when you are a University Professor or better you will be in a position to assess my academic and intellectual capacities (you would need to be at my level or better in the Australian Qualifications Framework, and I suspect that would not be the case with a farmer, particularly one so easily led up the garden path as you are). I notice you didn't answer the question about hog-tying your dog and cutting its throat either; that is odd. You should also be a little more cautious whel labelling others "ill-informed". You have no way of knowing what we know.

The Deneb Prima (now the Stella Deneb) and the Becrux are two of the very small minority of livestock carriers that are less than 20 years old or more. The former has failed inspections in Australian ports, and the latter had the maiden voyage from hell (read the report at www.liveexportshame.com). I suspect that they even be marginally better run than most. That's why they are the only ones journos and the like are allowed to see. And they only do short-haul stuff within Australia (e.g Professor Clive Phillips) unless they are a journo with vested interests. By the way - AMSA (Marine Orders 43) is not the regulatory framework applied to livestock carriers any more, that responsibility was handed to AQIS (on the basis that AQIS knows nothing about ships and AMSA knows nothing about animals. More startling insights from the "clever country", which sends its profits to countries whose stated objective is to blow the western world into oblivion.

If what you say is reality, then you people are no better than the Arab butchers, are you? Others of us know that reality is there, and we despise it and want no part in it. Don't condemn us for beng dreamers because we are not as brutal and egregiously cruel as you are. We would seek to raise standards, not descend to your level.
This trade is a continuing shame on the collective Australian conscience.

penny, the fact is deaths on board compare favorably with losses on land. Currently around 1%, which includes those culled while at sea, to stave of starvation. Lots of "possibly alives" there. As to throats cut, what do you think is going to happen at the other end?

If the live exporters are ripping farmers off, but still paying more per sheep, then what are the Australian processors doing? Ripping extra?

I'll be happy to read any link showing 40000 job losses, and will apologise for my folly. At $40K each that would be $1.6 billion, ever so slightly in excess of tens of millions in apparent subsidy. Approx 10% of animals turned off go to live export, so there must be an awful lot of people employed for the other 90%, about 360 000 if these job "losses" are to be believed.

However if each only chopped up a sheep every second day(40000x120/year=4.8 million) it would explain why farmers are being ripped off

Penny
Welcome 'Perfect'

The title of this thread- Did ALP Lie= pre elections= mislead the public?
I am `personally` preparied to disclose this much 'only'

I received a call from Kerry OBriens advisor pre elections.


This was pre the ABC LandLine Comment. I can say "in all honesty" it did change the course of our intentions , movements pre elections including a prior invitation to meet with kevin Rudd which I did not follow up on.

Do I feel I was lied to or mislead? I will answer that later.
ALP play it very differently to the libs.

below prior promises -

http://wa.amieu.asn.au/pages.php?recid=23

Labor will establish an Industry Task Force comprising of government, employee and employer representatives to develop strategies to address:
The need for long-term sustainable employment in the industry;
The need to develop an industry wide marketing plan aimed at increasing the export of processed meat;
The viability of establishing a quota system;
The need to develop a package of other measures of assistance to promote the long-term viability of our meat processing industry; and
Other measures that will promote and encourage improved competitive position of the process meat industry vis a vie live meat exports.
pale said
[ mind You They gave the job to Mr Chance]

Today I listended to ALP Assistant treasuer. I was impressed with what I heard.
Time will tell.

Thank You Nicky- Yes that is the progect.To Slaughter here and knock out the middle man live export agents, by the Muslims dealing 'direct' with farmers having shares in local plants with Saudi`s funding it.

Much better deal for farmers.Slaughter here - send carcuss for JAKIM accreditation for distribuation to ME.

We have established five AQIS accreditations to resume so far and two other plants but need helpers.

No funds to pale. Donation to others
Assisted two others[small] so far= Japan China.
However problem now with pre stunn laws and broken MOUS from `some`

Muslim Leaders " however not all".

Yabby the 150 that closed was similar to a Woolworths take over.

It was designed to stay within Trade practises and ACCC laws.

Rojo said
penny, the fact is deaths on board compare favorably with losses on land.
pale
please prove it with figures please. Be mighty interestng where you get them from. Please give us a break on so called Government figures we all know they are heavily distored.

If the live exporters are ripping farmers off, but still paying more per sheep, then what are the Australian processors doing? Ripping extra?
pale
farmers are still getting between 29 and thirty two bucks more and they have little choice as we have bugger all plants to send them now due to a evil long term plan by certain companies to turn animals into trade deals.
same as the producers- the big stores are ripping everyone same as petrol like woolworths.

Of course the plants have closed because of lack of stock pluss high labour costs.
After all that was the plan

I'll be happy to read any link showing 40000 job losses, and will apologise for my folly.
pale replies

Ok its late now however your not so silly that ou do not know shearing tanneries , hides small goods boneing pluss plumbers cleaners packaging transport to mention a few jobs lost easily tripples that then some.

However if each only chopped up a sheep every second day(40000x120/year=4.8 million) it would explain why farmers are being ripped off
Because they could do much better.- Even better than the ME plant owners.
Also there is no future for their kids grandkids and shame in being in this industry now at all


Posted by rojo, Thursday, 3 January 2008 12:28:08 AM

Just to clarify the hog tying matter.

It is not illegal and their are an array of devices available to do it.
http://www.fmb.com.au/index1.html - Just a few available.

A reality check for those with no experience in sheep farming; there are times when they are necessary. If I am riding through a paddock and find a sheep that is ill, injured or fly struck, I would not hesitate to hog tie it to be able to carry it back on my bike for treatment. I will use whatever is handy, the collar off one of my working dogs works a treat.

Cutting throats of sheep (without first stunning) for home kills or to put them down is not illegal either.