Tao “think that anyone envies you.”
Even on a boring day, I could not care less about other peoples negative emotions.

Re Iraq. Plenty of things undertaken by government might conflict with our individual views.
Such is the nature of democracy, the worst form of government, except for every other form which has ever been tried.

Those murdered and tortured by the baathists?
If you are telling us do not support the removal of Saddam Hussein, then you are complicit in the crimes which he undertook and carry the blood of his victims on your hands.

When you get elected, you will have greater influence, until then you are demonstrating the empty rattle of the little man.

For myself, I choose to cut my path through life without the fetters of an employer and with less government involvement than would be the case if the small minded, envious political luddites and engineers of socialism ruled.

I would remove all the wasteful “offices of nothingness”, like the equal opportunities commission from the burden of the tax payer.

As for “the rich”, oh bring out the trumbils and off with their heads,
Your politics of division and envy, churn up hatred for those who seem to have more than you, shout loud the petty jealousies, the hallmark of most of your posts.

In monetary terms I am not presently particularly wealthy, the consequence of 2 divorces, but my “wealth” is in the circle of people who, by their actions when needed, have demonstrated a “love” for me which few other people will ever experience. The generated sense of worth and self esteem which I have cannot be bought at any price. The sad part, I suspect you will never understand or experience what I am talking about.

As for “deny, deny, deny and lie, lie, lie.”

illustrates how little you know of me, how I work at what I do but then, when did facts, morals or ethics have anything to do with what you post? (I am being rhetorical).

Col
GST is collected by all businesses but paid by none, sales tax only affected a few and the major complication was sales tax exemption numbers (you know the businessman with a hobby farm claiming to be a primary producer).

The states are doing exactly what was agreed, they only ever had to look at removing taxes there was and is no compulsion for them to do it. Guess what? They looked. It was only Liberal Party spin that these taxes would be removed.

Good old Fringe Benefits, the long lunch as a tax deduction, the company car, the paying of school fees, etc etc. The perks of the business owner enabling them to avoid paying tax.

Has the waterfront really improved? Sure they get containers off ships faster then they get stuck in bond and you have to hope the Customs computer system works, then maybe a couple of weeks later you get your goods.

I was talking about the size of the Government Bureaucracy not about tax take, even when so much has been outsourced the bureaucracy, which you have often complained about ,is now much larger (although it did shrink for a couple of years when Howard was first elected).

Is your calculation about tax as a percentage of GDP inclusive of GST or not? My understanding is that if you include GST it is higher. (Of course it is debateable whether this is a State or Federal Tax).

Is our economy booming? Tasmania in recession, NSW and Victoria close, SA and NT not far behind if it was not for the mining industry in WA and QLD we would be in recession now. Is 0.3% growth in the last quarter a boom?

Who “locked in” low inflation and who has squandered the benefits?

Col,

“I could not care less about other peoples negative emotions”.

Why then, do you constantly refer to what you perceive to be other peoples’ emotions (particularly envy) in an attempt to dismiss their comments? You appear to depend on the phrase “politics of envy”, and related ones, very heavily in arguments – where would you be without it?

“Re Iraq. Plenty of things undertaken by government might conflict with our individual views.

So you don’t wish to have “collective responsibility” (taxes, provision of social services) imposed on yourself (i.e. deducted from the profit you extract from the work of your employees), but when others are imposed upon it is merely a “conflict” with our “individual views”. You obviously don’t feel the need to take a principled stand against all forms of imposition, only the ones you disagree with, and which hamper your efforts to exploit others. I dare say you will support conscription when it is reintroduced.

“If you are telling us do not support the removal of Saddam Hussein, then you are complicit in the crimes which he undertook and carry the blood of his victims on your hands.”

Really? Complicit like selling him the WMD chemicals and technology? Complicit like helping him rort the UN Sanctions? Complicit like supporting him financially and militarily for years until he would no longer sell me his oil at a cheap price, after which I concocted a scheme to install a new puppet regime which will do my bidding? It is your heroes who are complicit in Saddam’s crimes, not people who oppose an imperialist war for the sole purpose of controlling the oil, which has killed hundreds of thousands, injured many more, and lain waste to a country. Typically, you echo your heroes’ simplistic good v evil rhetoric, which most reasonable people have managed to see through by now, except of course – you.

“I choose to cut my path through life without the fetters of an employer and with less government involvement”.

So you choose to BE THE FETTER of an employer. Not only that, to be successful, your business is RELIANT on the work of those nine salespeople you have just trained. Further you are RELIANT ON THE STATE to SUPPRESS those workers’ attempts to get a better deal for themselves. And before you say that you will reward individual effort, but not collective action, remember that it is your employees’ CHOICE of whether they take action collectively or not. It is the STATE which suppresses those workers’ right to CHOOSE. (By the way, I don’t support the current trade union leadership or their flawed ideology, but I defend workers’ right to organise themselves).

Go ahead and deny it all Col. Deny and lie.

I will give Col credit for employing 9 salesmen, I am not implying Col does this but many sales staff are employed as "contractors" ie they get paid on a commission only basis, get their own ABN, pay their own super etc.

This allows the business owner to take no risk, the employees cost them nothing, if they sell enough product to make the boss happy they keep the job, if they do not meet their targets they get shafted.

I worked at one company where I was the only employee, the sales staff even had to buy their own printer ink cartidges if they wanted to use a printer.

These people were "employed" even if some weeks they made absolutely nothing.

How many people are "employed" like this?

Yebiga and all. Quite a passionate thread this one. Great to see.

Yeby.. your opening thread was well written, but your biases and economic short sightedness came out when you said "We are wealthy because of China" which presumably means the wealth generated by digging stuff out of the ground and shipping it off to China.

Now.. even my favorite Aunti Blind Nellie can see how short sighted this is.

1/ New sources could be discovered anytime in other countries. (who can then offer a better price to the Chinese, and kill us)

2/ The 'stuff' will eventually run out.

The problem is not 'HOWARD' its the pathetic lame gutless unadventurous spineless lack of creativity and pro-active management of this economy by BOTH sides. We have Labor and Coalition fighting over the best deck chairs on the freaking TITANIC.

Its like when you go through a speed camera.. you see the FLASH, but it takes time for the notification of the fine to arrive, but you KNOW its-a-comin. Just so will the rude shock arrive when someone else discovers abundant resources and overtakes our markets.

For examples of Successful Government directed economies....

LOOK AT S.KOREA....and learn. (Pop 48mil)
LOOK AT SINGAPORE... and learn. (Pop 4.4mil)
LOOK AT TAIWAN ... and learn. (Pop 22mil)
LOOK AT MALAYSIA....and learn (Pop 25mil)

5 year plans.... they work.

What stands out in the above countries ? Simple-they want the COUNTRY to advance, rather than just their own party.

Our problem is that the only goal Political parties seem to have is....'get into power..and STAY there'.
The issues they use to get there.. are beyond lame. "David Hicks" "sorry" woah... my goodness... yep..I see it all now. Fix these things and UTOPIA will arrive.