Yabby, I totally agree with Nicky and Bronwyn here.

You said, "I also accept reality, I do not deny it."
Well, I think you DO deny reality.
The reality is that live exports are very cruel. It's the sheep's reality that you have to look at.

Nicky is not denying reality, she is aware of it and therefore wants to help change it in favour of the animals.
And there is nothing wrong with being committed to changing a reality that you don't like.

It's not about denial it's about acceptance of a reality.

Even though I don't always agree with what Nicky says, I respect her choices (e.g. to not wear ugg boots) and I have not found her disrespectful of my choices (to eat free range meat and eggs and sit on a leather sofa).
There is a difference between lecturing people and educating them. I feel that Nicky does the latter.

People should simply breed and raise animals locally, not transport them over too long distances to the other end of the world just to be taken to an abattoir at the end of a long journey.

"The reality is that live exports are very cruel. It's the sheep's reality that you have to look at."

I too agree. This form of export of animals is in violation of animal rights laws, which are varied from vegetarianism. Reasonable, clean and safe environement for animals is the onus of the owner.

'NOT TO LEAVE A HOLE IN THE GROUND IN AN ANIMAL'S VICINITY' refers to a safe environment for animals outside their natural habitat. Many animals die during transport - paving the way for another violation, that of consuming a dead animal, resulting in dangerous effects for humans. The animal must be respected even during slaughtering.

What I like about fur is the way my girlfriend looks, sprawled naked across it.

The sensuous and sensual experience is quite unique.

Fur is good

It is best when it is appreciated

And I do so much appreciate it.

But you are right, fur is never cool….

It is hot, hot, hot. . . .

Oh no, too much information!

'coz now I’m stuck with an image of Col having his way with Grevilla de Vil on a fur rug at Hell Hall.

Cruella de Vil, that is.

Hi all

Bronwyn, Celivia and IamJoseph, thank you for your comments. Yabby is always keen to stereotype anyone who is against long distance transport of animals, and other cruelties which are practiced upon "farmed" animals is "extremist" because it suits his purpose. Such practices would never be tolerated upon "companion" animals. An example is a current case in the Northern Territory - 1400 wild goats were transported from NSW to Darwin without food or water for 65 hours. 330 died as a result of the trauma and distress. How much of this do we just not hear about?

Various members of my family, friends and colleagues eat meat, wear wool and leather, and have leather sofas; I simply choose not to do so myself. I also choose not to buy products made in China and Korea where that is discernible and make conscious decisions about products which have been tested on animals. I simply make choices according to my own conscience. I choose not to watch animals being ripped apart by other animals on documentaries, in the knowledge that these animals are not deliberately cruel as is the human species. Sure, it is "nature", but I wonder at the sort of people want to watch it ad nauseum.

I have no idea what an "Opus Dei Catholic" is, so I can only assume that I am not one. Self-flagellation doesn't do it for me, I'm afraid, Yabby. I do, however, find Yabby's comment about my choices about not having children offensive and presumptuous in the extreme - but not unusual, because insulting is his debating style, along with throwing in "red herrings" such as religion. Having said that, I don't doubt that he believes that he treats his animals well (after he has mulesed them (if they are that type of sheep), castrated them, and seen them off on transport to who knows where or to slaughter).

Col Rouge, I have no alternative but to treat your post with the contempt it so deserves. I see nothing humorous in the way animals are brutalized for their fur in China.

Nicky