Yabby, you continue to be blinded by your own self-importance. Can you please quantify the exact value to the economy of (for the year 2006-2007):

Live animal exports
Frozen/chilled meat exports
Other agricultural exports (grains and other crops)

Education
Business services
Tourism
Retail

Just some examples for comparative analysis. This is in view of the fact that agriculture contributes just 3% of GDP.

You might also, in your self-professed wisdom, quantify the opportunity cost of live exports in relation to the frozen meat trade (assuming that you understand the term "opportunity cost", of course).

Dickie clearly does. Against all that, the cost of livestock farming to the environment should also be factored in. It should be noted too that most people who receive Centrelink benefits are subject to an Activity Test - but not farmers.

Nicky

All that you have shown so far Nicky, is how little you understand
about how economies work. But then of course you will say anything to try
and run down farming, we know that.

Your very own quote should have made you sit up and take notice:

*Modern farming generates $103 billion-a-year in production for the national economy (underpinning 12% of GDP*

So I shall try and explain it slowly, so that even you understand:

Primary wealth generators are critical to any economy. The Saudis
and others have oil wells, Europe, Japan, China etc have manufacturing,
we have farming and mining. “ Nicky’s doggie walking service “
can add to GDP, its just not critical.

I remind you that our current account deficit runs at around 6% of GDP.
That is the highest in the developed world. Beyond that you are heading
for banana republic status, with Pakistan and South Africa at 8% and
interest rates to match. In other words, given that we cannot pay our
overseas bills, we rely on overseas investors to lend us the money each
month. As our current account worsens, they charge more.

So each time another boatload of wheat is exported, not only is it critical
for our current account, but in effect that money will circulate around 4-6
times in the economy, as all the hangers on turn it over. Farmers, miners,
buy things, which employ people, which employ other people, etc. etc.

That is why your 3% of GDP turns into more like 12% of GDP. Manufacturers,
service providers etc, rely on primary wealth creators to function.

If farming stopped tomorrow, not only would your current account and interest
rates go through the roof, as you borrowed ever more in a spiral, your unemployment
would rocket and your economy would crash, your peso would have to try
and pay for food imports on top of that. You clearly underestimate the importance
of farming to our economy.

Farming will be here next year, as people have to eat. The tourists and students
might not be.

Yabby, that is absolute rubbish and you know it. The original quote came from the LiveExportCare website and was shown immediately below to be fraudulent. And you didn't answer my questions - as always.

"Official Australian ABS data beyond a broad industry level is not published in the Yearbook however, it is clearly indicated that employment in the Agricultural sector has decreased by over 81,300 the last 5 years. The ABS uses the Australian and New Zealand Standard Industrial Classification (ANZSIC) to determine the predominant industry in which a person works and does not have a specific classification code for people for whom it could be determined are employed solely in the live export industry. Indeed, ABS major economic indicators such as the Average Weekly Earnings Survey do not even include the Agricultural industry division when collecting and compiling data".

(Prepared by an ABS statistician)

But let's go back to the original topic of this thread. Do you think the way imported animals are handled and slaughtered in the Middle East is acceptable?

Nicky

Nicky, of course its not rubbish, its basic economics, but that is
clearly a field you know very little about. Its no different to
the mining industy. Total direct employment of people hardly matters,
its the overall effect on the economy that is crucial. As anyone
will tell you, mining is once again absolutaly crucial to the
Australian economy, despite directly employing very few.

But money spent by mining companies, for machines, materials,
services,
etc etc is absolutaly enormous. Export wealth generated
by mining, in terms of boatloads of coal or iron-ore, is once
again very crucial to Australian well being.

Farms are no different. Productivity is generated by larger and
larger machines, as with mining, but the wealth returned to the
economy is extremely important.

As to the ME, some animals are handled acceptably, some perhaps
not. We have seen no objective studies on this, just some
propaganda. But then some animals are not handled acceptably in
Australia either. Mind you, defining what is acceptable is
quite different in my terms or your terms. You still think that
hogtying a sheep is unacceptable, anyone knowing about sheep would
strongly disagree with you. They are different to dogs, no need
to hog tie them, as they react differently. That is the bottom
line

Yabby, you need no help from anyone to discredit Australian farmers, you do a great job of that yourself, telling us what is "common practice" on Australian farms.

I think you should (as was suggested on another thread) take yourself on a trip on, say the "Al Kuwait:, or the "Maysora" (not the "Becrux", and spend the time with the animals. See, for example, with the penning arrangements, how many animals can reach the feed/water, and how much of the time it is full of excrement from animals penned above.

Going back to the question of AQIS, I refer you once again to the mortality reports that have been released, which, almost without exception, note that the animals did not have the "mandated period" in "registered premises" (feedlots), that exporters must provide more space on the ships, they must carry an AQIS veterinarian on a subsequent voyage and/or they mush carry enough medical supplies. Those are clear, identifiable and quantifiable breaches of the ALES. But do we see sanctions of any meaning by AQIS? Never. And it has nothing to do with "intelligence" and everything to do with inefficiency and laziness on the part of AQIS, if the reports by Animals Angels stating that they have had to CALL AQIS to attend loadings in Fremantle are any indication.

And that's while the animals are still, in theory, under the protection of the POCTAA legislation of whatever state from which they are departing. Based on that, you can't even get it right in Australia, and who knows how many mishaps have gone unreported.

As for "objective studies" on practices in the Middle East, filmed evidence does not lie. The gospel according to MLA clearly does though.

Nicky

*you do a great job of that yourself, telling us what is "common practice" on Australian farms.*

Nicky, I tell you the reality and I do not shy away from it. Things
are done for good reasons. That you don't understand those reasons,
knowing nothing about livestock and farming, explains it all.
Some people are ignorant and they can't be helped. You are a classic
case of that.

Once again you raise the issue of sheep poo. You still don't know
that on farms, sheep commonly camp in one spot, on their own poo,
week after week. In Africa they make floors of the stuff. It
is not like your poo, but then all this is way over your head
yet once again.

AQIS are doing fine, as usual you just want something else to
quibble about. Hey, fanatics like you work in every Govt dept,
pushing pencils. They hold up productivity and cost everyone
heaps. We are used to them.

Filmed evidence can be used to create propaganda, for we can
film evidence of cruelty to animals, to humans and to just
about anything else, in every country of the world. You are
not about presenting objective information, but are about propaganda
to promote your cause and philosophy. Ok we know that, we take
that into account and take little notice of you. We then rely
on more qualified and less fanatical people for our information.