Yabby, of course you would think AQIS is doing fine. That's because they are apparently rarely present to do their job. My own observations of loadings demonstrated that as well, and I have photographic evidence of manifest failure of AQIS, and the other authorities present (few and far between as they were). But you wouldn't have read those mortality reports, would you?

Sheep choosing to stand amongst odd deposits of excrement is one thing; force feeding it to them on ships, and having them swim in it and urine while trying to breathe ammonia fumes is rather different (think 25-30 year old "closed" carriers like the "Merino (aka Cormo) Express" and the "Al Messilah". The old car transporters. Perhaps you should do your trip on one of those, providing you agree not to leave the hold in which the animals are confined for the duration, and you go to a pre-determined number of slaughtering facilities).

You accuse me/us about promoting propaganda. Read some of your own posts. I know whose reality I would rather trust and it isn't someone who openly admits to abusing his own animals for profit.

Nicky

Deary me Nicky, what melodrama. The animals on my farm lead far
more free and natural lives then your domestic pets!

Do you know anything about livestock nutrition at all? Nitrogen
coming out the back is only an issue, if too much is going in at
the front. So nutritionists adjust feed formulas to include less
protein. Sheep poo is fairly dry when they are on dry feed and
any pee is soon evaporated by the air systems. Fact is that
in the paddocks, sheep on sheep camps spend months camping on
the same spot, for 5-6 hours a day. But you just once again
want to quibble about things that you don't understand.

I doubt if AQIS would pay much attention as to what you or
other wharf demonstrators think. Perhaps they keep away as some
look like they have not had a wash for weeks!

But you shuffle your papers there, it keeps you occupied

Hardly melodrama, Yabby, it is filmed and documented fact. I think I asked you before somewhere if you could refer me to any scientific studies available on "shy-feeding" (starvation) and the respiratory diseases that afflict animals on these ships as a result of ammonia fumes, and you were unable to do so.

There are also reports available about the efficiency (or in fact otherwise) of the air systems on these crappy old ships too, and the fact that they are frequently not even used once the ships leave Australian waters, because they are costly to run. There is a world of difference between closed and open decked carriers in this regard. BTW, three years does seem rather a long time to build two livestock carriers, regardless of your protestations, I'd suggest, and you couldn't provide any updates on that either.

If you are playing in sheep droppings all day, I'd suggest that wharf protesters (of whom I may or not be one) would be far cleaner than you are.

AQIS doesn't pay a whole lot of attention to anything much in the live animal trade either really, whether it is protesters or other authorities. That much is self-evident.

Are you going to take up my challenge?

Nicky

To Yabby c/- Pathological Liars No Liabilities

Report (2008)

A special risk of high humidity occurs in sheep pens if the faecal pad breaks up and becomes effectively a slurry. The floors of the ship decks are impervious and, unlike cattle pens which are cleaned out on a regular basis, the faeces and urine from sheep is allowed to accumulate for the duration of the voyage.

Normally, a hard pad is formed, which makes a suitable lying surface for the sheep. However, in very humid conditions, a slurry is formed, which will probably reduce the welfare of the sheep. On other occasions, sea water may wash onto lower decks, causing the faecal pad again to turn into a slurry. This can cause mortality in the sheep, but would also reduce welfare by potentially water-logging the animals or causing them to stand in water. Some ships are fitted with walls that can be erected to protect against the ingress of sea water on lower decks, but they reduce ventilation and are only erected in high seas.

High ammonia concentrations, can probably be addressed by controlling feed nitrogen content and cleaning procedures, but again there would be a significant cost to the industry. Further research is undoubtedly needed on this topic. It seems likely that further research is required before a precise model of nitrogen inputs to ammonia output can be constructed.

The livestock exporters are keenly aware of the threat to their industry arising from public perceptions of some operators’ inadequate attention to welfare, but it must be remembered that they are only one part of the chain of management of livestock from when they are first received until the point of departure. This contrasts with the relative lack of control over the export process when the animals are in their country of destination, which makes the practice ethically questionable.

The standards which have evolved over more than 20 years of experience are those that lead to maximum financial gain for the exporter and not optimum welfare of the stock. Exporters are driven by financial objectives, so this is not surprising.

For you Nicky, I would hardly lift a finger lol. You are simply
not worth the bother. There was a conference in Perth involving
all the scientific community and others who work on live sheep
issues, just a month or two ago. They do the research, they have the papers, they
write the papers. If you are so keen, chase them up.

I have no need to play in sheep droppings, the sheep do that. But
interestingly, they hardly smell at all and you don't even
get dirty, as they are like round marbles or smarties. But then
you know so little about sheep, you would not even know that.

Check the specifications that ships have to comply with, to find out just
how much air that is circulated on these boats. I certainly hope
that they switch them off when its really windy at sea, or it
would be too windy in there. I agree, open sided ships would
be better then close sided ships. But then the animal liberationists
claim that they are not protected from the weather. One can't win
with you lot as no matter what the trade does, you still complain.

If you people spent a bit of time looking at animal cruelty right
there in your suburbs, your time would be better spent. But then
you are obsessed with the live trade and of course it raises lots
of revenue for some groups, as they market their propaganda, put
together by cause related marketing specialists.

Great to hear that AQIS take no notice of you.

Hi Dickie

Is that from the RSPCA's report by Bidda Jones? I've read similar before, but we knew it was true anyway, didn't we? When sheep are standing in "slurry" (molten manure, basically) for such periods they are also at risk of footrot/lameness, and that's why many cannot walk when they arrive.

That also bears out my point about insufficient research having been carried about ammonia levels and their effects (refer "Maysora" voyage of cattle, October 2006. On that voyage, on which nearly 500 cattle died, either on board or straight after arriving in Israel, it was also found that southern bred cattle were exported at a time of the year when the ALES prohibits that without substantial "heat-stress modelling" - done by the exporters, of course!). They are so good at complying with their OWN standards!

Cheers!
Nicky