Hey! Lord-of-the-Manor,

Why don't you just give it away? You're not going to win with Nicky/Gertie/Thel/and Lou you know. They're running rings around you.

Silly twisted boy.

Hi all
Ginx, I do love your posts. Thank you!

PALE, one question - what makes you think you know it all? You have your theories, just as others do. There are many organizations in this, all doing their bit. You just want everyone to do it your way, and everyone to convert to your philosophy. One of the stumbling blocks would be the perception surrounding your directorship of HKM, I'd suggest - that would be mutually exclusive to the ethos of any other animal group. They do not want to be participants in slaughter. Nor do I. And your way is defintely not the only way or something a bit convincing would have happened with it.

Yabby, as for Siba Ships, the "Deneb Prima" is not their first transporter. Here are3 others:-

“Pollux” – (Siba Ships, built in 19730
Detentions 1997 and 2004
1997
“(Ventilators, air pipes, casings, Number/composition (according to safe manning document), Windows, side scuttles, Ventilators, air pipes, casings, Emergency lighting, batteries & switches, Maintenance of ship and equipment, Other (working space)”

2004
“CERTIFICATION AND WATCHKEEPING FOR SEAFARERS, certificates for master,officer,Second Engineer do not hold flag State Certificate of Competency or Endorsement/Recognition; CERTIFICATION AND WATCHKEEPING FOR SEAFARERS, manning specified by the minimum safe manning document, Ship`s manning do (sic) not meet requirement specified by Minimum Safe Manning document; LOAD LINES, windows, side scuttles, Various deadlights for side scuttles/windows not able to be secured closed (Registro Italiano Navale); LOAD LINES, ventilators, air pipes, casings, One ventilator pipe at aft deck wasted/holed (Registro Italiano Navale)”.

"Bellatrix (built 1976 now the "Al Mahmoud X V”) Three detentions, when operated by Siba Ships (no further data but you get the picture)

“Uniceb” (previously “Benlawyers”, built 1970)
between 1982 and 1991. The “Uniceb” caught fire in 1996, and 67,488 sheep either burned to death or drowned in the NINE DAYS before any rescue attempts were made.

Bit of a credibility gap, I reckon. It really isn't about a "sound hull" equating to "seaworthiness". Data from the Fairplay International Register of Shipping, Tokyo MoU.

Cheers
Nicky

Ah Nicky, just shows the massive improvements going on in the
industry! Now the Becrux, plus 2 specially designed new ones.
Things are improving, standards are lifting, as we keep saying.

Let me think of all the airlines who have had planes crashing,
killing people. Yet we still fly in them. The Titanic sank,
we built better ships. Not close down shipping.

The real problem with so called animal liberators such as yourself,
Peta and others, is that you would rather close down farming.
So you are unable to have any kind of objective opinion about
farming or the live trade, as your ideology and minds are made
up long ago. That is exactly why you are considered extremist and
sidelined by the more rational amongst us :)

Dear me, Yabby, with that track record, I'd say some improvement was sorely needed. The maiden voyage of the "Becrux" was one of the industry's worst disasters too, or are you able to gloss over that fiasco as well with fantasising about "improvements" according to the gospel of MLA/LiveCorp? How gullible you are!

The other small point worth mentioning is that people generally are on aircraft by choice and in full knowledge of the risks.The same applies to the Titanic. You really cannot cover up these ongoing fiascos. What explanation do you have for the "Cormo Express"? Humour me, please. And the Maysora's MULTIPLE disasters?

PALE, I'm sorry, but if your "trained", "skilled" migrant workers are of the type that I've been hearing about in recent reports, I'd suggest that you'll have to find another way. We do not want to get Australian animal welfare standards for "farm" animals any lower than they already are.

Cheers
Nicky

*people generally are on aircraft by choice and in full knowledge of the risks.The same applies to the Titanic.*

Hehe, I love the logic. If people are there by choice and they happen
to die, well too bad. Nicky, you humanist you :)

That standards have improved can be measured. Right now we have
world's best practise in shipping livestock.

The Cormo was about two Saudi interests fighting, the ship was
caught in the crossfire. 90% of the livestock were still fine,
despite the long journey. We've now got protocols in place, so
that the same thing can't happen again.

The thing is, as a farmer hater you are unable to think about these
things rationally. Too much interference from your ideology.

Ok, so subsistance farmers like yourself clearly are not included
in your hatred :)
.

Nicky Said

PALE, one question - what makes you think you know it all?

Pale replies.= Nicky that’s disingenuous of you to start with

Pale has never said they know it all.

What pale are saying” again”= What your lot think THEY know it all?

What gives them the right to black list our organization on the basis they do not agree with us.?

Why on earth, considering they are protesting Animal Cruelty, by Muslims, would they not feel, it might be prudent, to sit at a table by our invitation to discuss this with Muslim Leaders in Australia and from overseas?

Nicky said=
There are many organizations in this, all doing their bit

Pale replies.

Doing what? Just saying its cruel. Not good enough!

Nicky said

One of the stumbling your directorship of HKM,

Pale replies,

Umm interesting- because in case you haven’t stopped to think -
Its common sense changes must be made "through the industry."

In short, what you are saying , could be interpreted that the peak groups oppose the meat industry full stop!



It plays right into the hands of the Government and the live export industry.


All your clever Uni students must be smarter than that.


What a wonderful ‘cop out’ for the Government to be able to say the peak Animal Welfare group of Australia are extreme.


Nicky said
You just want everyone to do it your way, and everyone to convert to your philosophy.

Pale

No we don’t Nicky.

We just wanted others to see the opportunities working together with Muslim leaders and farmers instead of against them.

It is your friend Glenyse in my honest opinion that has that problem- not us.

And for goodness sake Gleynse don’t rush your lawyer to OLO and threaten to sue unless again unless you can back it up .

I have challenged you many times along with the head of PETA to debate us on this.