Dear Is Mise,

Again with the same old argument that all Muslims
follow all the bad bits in the Koran. And you are
arguing that the Koran is to blame for violent
behaviour. Ignoring the fact that it is fundamentalists that
adapt what is written to suit their extremist
ideologies and views - as extremists do in all religions.
"The Devil made me do it!" "The voices told me to kill!"
And so on.

The vast majority of modern mainstream Christians, Jews,
and Muslims seek a better life on earth, rather than
seeking it in heaven. Even if they believe in heaven, they
seek to have a happy life on earth. Modern people (with
normal family and social relationships, and an at least
partially rational view of how the world works) are not
waiting for Armageddon, or a future coming of a saviour.

Nor are they waiting for anything else that exercises
the theological minds of fundamentalists. I repeat that
the religiously-minded person is not a 'card-carrying'
fundamentalist. The latter are a tiny minority. Of
whatever faith. A psychologist would be likely to declare
them (as I've stated previously many times) to be of
unsound mind.

Modern people are focused on improving the human condition on
earth. Their attitude is in direct contrast to the vision
of fundamentalists. Religious fundamentalism - where belief
is in the literal word of the Bible, the Koran or the Torah,
as the rule book for how to live and die - is the arch enemy
of achieving a good life on earth because if you seek
(and, for some fundamentalists you want to get there as soon
as possible) what you do on earth today and what you do to
your fellow human beings does not matter. In fact, if Armageddon
is a necessary precursor to the second coming (and utopia in
heaven) you will destroy and kill to accelerate your embrace by
God in the hereafter. Very, very sad. And pathologically sick

IS MISE your obvious intransigence on the subject of; choice of Tactics, Firearms and Ordnance, used by police at the Lindt Cafe operation, is utterly breathtaking.

Together with your lack of understanding and appreciation of how exactly the media, the Coroner's Office and the public at large, can and does have a negative impact on police command. You say, '...A good commander wouldn't let them within a 1000yards of the operation, let alone inviting them in...'? Well, I guess you've identified another strategic police failure. They should've invited you to become the 'special counsel' assisting the Coroner. You could've really decimated the coppers then eh.

I wonder what it is that's triggered your obvious antipathy you harbour against police? Problems with licensing of your F/A's? Difficulties with your outspoken assertions that you have the undeniable right to posses, carry and use a handgun for your own protection. Somehow I reckon it's all tired up with something like this my friend isn't it.

Given your above observations, together with your opinion re. the injudicious use of Ball ammunition at the Lindt Cafe, I'd be most grateful indeed if you'd kindly appraise me of what precisely you would've done, if you'd been OIC of police on the day in question?

You say your daughter was at the 'sharp end' of F/A's training for the Police Force. What lucky Police Force got the benefit of all her training? This is second time I've asked you IS MISE? Please tell me? Or have you made a simple error during the excitement of responding to my ridiculous assertions on the topic of F/A's?

o sung wu,

I fully appreciate how things have a negative impact on police command, that's why I wouldn't have the media within 1000 yards of an operation.
The media are there to report the news not to help make it, which of course they do by their negative impact.

"I wonder what it is that's triggered your obvious antipathy you harbour against police?"

I have consistently stuck up for the police on this and other forums, it is not the fault of the ordinary policeman or woman that they do not get sufficient firearm training, it is the fault of higher command (a higher command that you have often criticized/condemned) and a parsimonious Government that won't spend on firearms training and ammunition.

As there was only one gunman in the cafe I'd have sent in a team of three armed with their pistols (because they normally carry them) and shotguns for immediate use.
Said shotguns loaded with No7 shot or smaller to minimise lethal ricochets, at the range involved such would have hit with lethal force.

Which police force my daughter was in is completely irrelevant to this discussion as is her present appointment.

Foxy, How many Muslims have you changed from radical to moderate or are you just talk.
It only takes 5% of a population to take over a society with its radical views. They estimate about 120,000 Muslims in Australia currently dispose Western Democracy and want an Islamic State. Have you talked to any and convinced them to recognise our great traditions as superior.

IS MISE...As you've an unusual penchant for laboriously dragging out a Topic to the point of complete tedium, I'll end my contribution to you, in regards to this specific topic.

I'm sorry IS MISE, you have no idea of what type of F/A training police in this country receive. Neither the content; the duration, or the qualifying standards they're required to reach. Nor do you know the intervals of time, before they're required to re-qualify, nor the standard they must attain. Notwithstanding the amount of training and time dedicated to the large number of 'live fire' 'Judgemental Shooting' serials.

If you did, much of what you've said would've been far more measured, and more factual in its censure, rather then these wild, unsubstantiated statements you've made herein. Any fair criticism, and I'd most likely agree with you.

No doubt there are deficiencies in police training, as there is in all types of formal instruction and tuition. But you Sir, are unable to correctly identify precisely what those inadequacy's are. Simply because you don't know, nor does your daughter, I say with respect.

The fact you've declined to identify exactly where it was (the Police Department) your daughter provided this 'F/A training', is most bizarre. After all its not a security issue IS MISE, and relevant it most definitely is.

In conclusion, I don't wish to be seen as being rude to you, a gentleman of 83 years. But your credibility is stretched beyond belief as far as I'm concerned. Your own level of knowledge relating to Police Firearms Training and Officer Survival Strategies and Tactics; And the peculiar antecedents of your daughter's 'alleged' F/A training of Police, is all rather sad. Especially for a old 3RAR veteran like you IS MISE, of whom I have nothing but respect.

Good, now we can get back on topic.