Nicky think about the elephant in the corner a bit more add the fact I sometimes agree with you.
Dickie best advise I can give myself is abandon animal rights threads, most do.
In a debate both sides get a hearing, the intent is to convince the other side some of what you say is true.
Skinning sheep alive?
Killing cattle while de sexing them?
My time owning cattle was hard enough I never killed them this way.
I am with great pride a trade unionist.
I understand some from my Field are less than perfect.
I admit it, but settle for being judged for my actions not others.
still I sell a product that I believe in.
Animal welfare is also a worthwhile product.
Claims of skinning sheep alive only harm that product.
in fact this thread is just a slanging match we could not sell water to a person lost in the desert using this thread.
It may one day be possible to talk about animal rights without self promotion and paranoia I do not think now is the time.

But unfortunately not by Yabby, it seems. And did anyone say that circumcision is the right thing to do?

Belly, I am also a strong supporter of the trade union movement, so I'm a bit surprised to hear you say that you are in favour of live exports when the (local) union position is to strongly oppose it, in view of the job losses it has and continues to cause. But we digress from the animals in China.

I think that at least by providing this thread I have managed to raise some awareness of their plight; petitions and letters are circulating, and the Chinese government is in a position where it has been exposed to international scrutiny on this and other matters.

I am making a conscious effort not to buy anything made in China, and asking more questions about the components of what I buy and their origin/s. I am also using my networks to encourage as wide a boycott as possible. A drop in the ocean? Maybe. But if enough people at least do that it must help.

I've also notified both WSPA and PETA via their websites. PETA has people "on the ground" all over SE Asia.

Nicky

*"Your letter stems from a commercial interest and a desire for development grants". (MLA to PALE)*

WRONG!

No! time for Government front men, be they MLA, Livecourpe, Austrade, FF.

When MLA call 9pm to claim they dont know a person +you are looking at a picture of them standing next to that person on a web site -

#It doesnt leave room for wanting futher contact.#

When they tell you there is 'nothing happening 'in Maylasia re Halal Meat -and "you have sat with delagtes of Maylasia Gov to make that country the hub of Halal carcuss= "after the Animal is slaughtered in Australia "-then you know they LIE!

http://www.worldhalalforum.org/

When the head of MLA calls you from ME and says there is no 'way they' will support anything that competes with live exports it DISCUSTS YOU!

What ever happened to healthly compertion.?

"They protect live exports with their lives their jobs"
and get quite offended if you suggest perhaps some of they buyers might like to expand to *producing and importing* cutting out the middle man .

The Minister of Trades job as Mark Vaile pointed out is to PROMOTE 'value adding ' of Australias products.
HuH! . I suppose thats why a staff member at MLA told us Mark 'personally 'arranged ships loads of Live Sheep to Kwaite. (Government to Government)

An absolute dicrace to think we allow Australia to be known as the largest exporter of LIVE Animals!

Its barbaric and unthinkable and no REAL farmer supports it.

They are being chased off and replaced by intensive feed lot corps that wouldn`t know a cow from a donkey.

Its a discrace and if you think I would take ONE cent of their lousey money you must be dreaming. I hope they ROT in hell!

To add insult to injury, you are then informed by the X Ministers advisor that Dr Wirth then WSPA President along with the UK head of RSPCA ,gave their commitement to 'support live exports' ?

(At the same time) launched a major campainge to fund raise and protest 'against' live exports ?

I really cannot decipher that at all. Can anyone translate it into something that might mean something please?

Nicky

Nicky dear, sweetheart, precious, the problem is that you just don't
get it! What you are doing is a great feelgood exercise, you might
even convince a couple of housewives not to use Chinese products,
but frankly, take a look at the big picture.

The Chinese economy is huge, and even if every single Australian
never bought a single Chinese product, it would hardly matter to them.

The reality is that these days, we need their consumer products, more
then they need our business.

To understand China, you need to go back in their history. Not so
many years ago, people in China were starving and anything with
4 legs, bar tables and chairs, was put in the cooking pot.
As the Chinese economy grows, things are slowly changing. Some
Chinese now even have pets, without the threat of them being eaten.

As China grows and becomes wealthier, yup, your Chinese RSPCAs will
appear, people will be able to afford and think about animal welfare,
something that does not happen much in countries where people are
starving. That is the reality.

If we look at the Western World, change did not come about overnight
with a snap,crackle and pop, but was slow and steady, one step at
a time. They same will happen in China.

All you are doing now, is making a fool of yourself. One minute you
scold people for being off topic, next minute you comment on anything
imaginable that has nothing to do with fur from China.

You are so deep in the forest, you don't even notice the trees

Sorry Nicky

I'm unable to decode the lingo either. And I see the comedian's at it again when he declares:

"you might even convince a couple of housewives not to use Chinese products,but frankly, take a look at the big picture."

If this witless ignoramus knew how to google "animal cruelty China," he would receive no fewer than 881,000 websites from around the globe, denouncing the Chinese for the atrocities they perpetrate on animals and urging readers not to buy Chinese products.

In addition to the fur trade Nicky, a "gourmet" in China can buy monkeys in the marketplace and send them to inns for cooking. The cooks first stuff the monkeys into tiny cages and forces them to drink rice wine until they're intoxicated. They are then pulled from the cage and bound by their limbs (preventing movement.)

Their skulls are hacked open with a sharp knife to reveal easily visible, pulsing blood vessels. The white brains are then scooped out and served as soon as possible; eaten when still warm with seasonings.

Monkey brains become pungent if they are not fresh if the skull was opened too long ago. Thus it is best to open the skull and eat at once, while brain cells are living and blood vessels throbbing.

Back to Belly who continues to evade my questions and feigns such surprise:

"Killing cattle while de sexing them?"

Belly why am I not surprised to witness your descent into the realms of the bushwacking degenerates, to join your brother-in-sadism, Yabby?:

"The Willis Drop Ovariectomy was 92 to 97% effective, depending on operator experience. The number of deaths was the same or higher in Willis spayed animals than other groups.

"The WDO suffers from requiring a high degree of skill in transrectal ovarian manipulation. There were more deaths than with traditional spay methods (flank.)" (Australian Veterinary Journal Jan. 2008)

"Skinning sheep alive?"

No Belly that is NOT what I said. You have conveniently omitted the word "partially:"

http://www.animalsaustralia.org/media/photos.php?campaign=15

"I am with great pride a trade unionist."

And a deceitful one at that!