The National Forum   Donate   Your Account   On Line Opinion   Forum   Blogs   Polling   About   
The Forum - On Line Opinion's article discussion area



Syndicate
RSS/XML


RSS 2.0

Main Articles General

Sign In      Register

The Forum > General Discussion > Enoch Powell.. Much more to be said

Enoch Powell.. Much more to be said

  1. Pages:
  2. 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. 4
  6. 5
  7. 6
  8. Page 7
  9. 8
  10. 9
  11. 10
  12. 11
  13. 12
  14. 13
  15. All
Dear PolyBOAZ

I know your attack on me is a strategy of deflection. But nevertheless, I'll take the bait. I am Anglo in ethnic origin and my family first came here from Britain in the 1840s. I'm 5th generation white Australian. I'm curious therefore to know how you deduce that I express 'anti Australian racism.. and anti Anglo racism'. Can you cite the words that led you to that weird allegation?

Now to the real debate. No matter how many times you say Enoch Powell was right, the facts of history all go the other way.

Let's have your evidence for your latest claims:

1. "Mass/uncontrolled immigration will lead to 1/ Segregation (it did)". What parts of Britain are segregated?

2. "Race riots (it did)". When was the last race riot in Britain?

As for your ahistorical claim that "... it was not 'immigration' that Powell was opposed to.. it was UNCONTROLLED immigration", you are plain wrong. He was opposed only to immigration from the non-white nations of the old British Empire. You yourself in your first post on this forum linked us to his speeches where he is clear on that point. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LKHAkpv22o&feature=related

He never spoke out about immigration from white Australia,white Canada or white Africa.

No DavidCarp, It was not UNCONTROLLED immigration that Powell opposed. It was immigration of people of colour he opposed. He tried to whip up fear and hatred with claims like this: "In this country in 15 or 20 years time, the black man will have the whip hand over the white man" (Powell 1968).

His racist appeal to impoverished whites had its moment but when people saw it for what it was, he sunk quickly into obscurity. The people of Britain were not fools. They had seen what racist demagogues could do in Europe and wanted none of it.
Posted by Spikey, Saturday, 9 August 2008 12:39:12 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
I was wondering pretty much the same thing, Spikey.

>>I'm curious therefore to know how you deduce that I express 'anti Australian racism.. and anti Anglo racism'<<

I thought earlier on that Boaz had mistaken you for someone else, but now he has repeated the slur.

Not that you will get an explanation, of course. The Boaz reaction to finding himself in a cul-de-sac is to walk away and pretend that nothing happened.

Unfortunately, as well as having a strong whack-a-mozzie tendency, our Boaz has an equally vicious - and equally uninformed - whack-a-pom streak in him. Most often, his chosen attack vector is via the Irish, about which he knows as little as he does about the English.

Except what he reads in Wikipedia and sees on YouTube, of course.

He occasionally slips in a little gratuitous barb, but usually misses his target completely. He did this earlier in this thread...

>>Pericles ancestors came as Anglo Saxons (?) and took the land.. driving the Celts into the Western corner of England..where even today they prefer to speak Welsh in the presense of English.<<

Apart from the fundamental ignorance of Celtic history, the idea that "they prefer to speak Welsh" is a hoot. Only one in five of the population speak the language at all.

The irony of this is, of course, that his hero Powell went on to represent the Ulster Unionists in Westminster, where he advocated the full integration of Ulster... not with Ireland, but with Great Britain. Here's an excerpt from Powell's obituary, written by Mike Phillips:

"As Ulster Unionist member for South Down (1983-87) he lived in the world of absolutes, of jet blacks and shining whites. In that sense if in no other, he was at home. Asked in an unguarded moment during an interview how often he went to Ireland he replied coldly that he never went to Ireland but frequently went to Ulster."

The other key aspect of Boaz, which he has carried forward into his new persona Polycarp, is that his research is inevitably lazy, and frequently contradicts his intended message.
Posted by Pericles, Saturday, 9 August 2008 4:40:02 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Dear Polycarp,

Not all people accept the prejudices of
their communities.

Social scientists have learned that some
people are more likely to form prejudices
than other people, which is the point I
was making in my previous post.

Education is part of the key in fighting
racism, another is changing the system
which produces the conditions that allow
it to grow.
Posted by Foxy, Saturday, 9 August 2008 6:54:58 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Hi Foxy
you mentioned "not all people accept the prejudices of their communities."

Fair point indeed.

One would need to place some boundaries around 'not all'...and give it a percentage for that to be more useful.

Bugsy.. 'race' .. tribe.. good grief.. you know what that means.
If you like substitute 'tribe'.... A tribe usually begins with a family.. a strong man with lots of wives.. flocks.. herds.. they build up over time and develop particular characteristics which are closely related to the founder, patriarch, king.. what have you.

They usually will have a common language and custom, and perceive themselves outside the rest of humanity. For obvious reasons of survival, they would be suspicious of non them, and if a threat arose, would tighten ranks and their 'they' consciousness would ramp up significantly.

Language..Culture.. color..physical features in various combinations constitute the various 'races'.

Georgia and Russia are currentl an example of 2 'tribes' manifesting the above.

The anecdote about Welsh preferring to speak Welsh in the presense of English, was passed on by "Mick" a pom at my gym.

Spikey.. I simply gave you a dose of what you were dishing out.
Powell was correct, and all the race riots (see wikipidia for a full list) testify to it.
Posted by Polycarp, Friday, 15 August 2008 6:34:20 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
BZZZZT, wrong answer try again.

You've been listening to Franky Goes To Hollywood again haven't you?.

"Australian" is neither a tribe nor a race. Australians cannot be defined by colour or culture. Australia is a nation.

I take it we must be post-"Rivers of Blood" then, if the race riots have already happened ages ago and not much since. So much for relevancy.
Posted by Bugsy, Friday, 15 August 2008 8:47:28 PM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
Polycarp,

I think you're having a touch of the Collywobbles. Your last half dozen posts have been abysmally poor; and I've noticed you're now squibbing it a lot more than the old BOAZY used to. You're not even trying to answer the questions that posters raise. And your erratic illogicalities are now more obvious than ever.

Time for another break and a comeback in another new disguise?
Posted by Spikey, Saturday, 16 August 2008 1:28:47 AM
Find out more about this user Recommend this comment for deletion Return to top of page Return to Forum Main Page Copy comment URL to clipboard
  1. Pages:
  2. 1
  3. 2
  4. 3
  5. 4
  6. 5
  7. 6
  8. Page 7
  9. 8
  10. 9
  11. 10
  12. 11
  13. 12
  14. 13
  15. All

About Us :: Search :: Discuss :: Feedback :: Legals :: Privacy