Dear Yabby,

Still with your head in the sand mate. First laughing off a drop in local beef sales then saying the whole protest against what has happened is a fizzer? Gee that's really smart, particularly for someone who wishes to see live meat exports continue from this country.

Last night we had a number of people around to watch a televised football match (go the Catters). I was asked to sign a petition against live exports addressed to our local member. When I asked where it had come from the reply was "off the Internet". This person, a meat eater, had taken the trouble to seek one out, print it, and bring it along to gather signatures on the night. They had never in my knowledge done anything like this before. Everyone signed, all this after a rather excellent Indian beef curry my wife had dished up.

To be laughing this off is just plain dumb. The export industry needs to take the six months to help the government to get this thing right. To just be sitting there lobbing hand grenades is not going to do one jolt for public sentiment, if anything it is going to stiffen the resolve and you may well lose the lot.

Finally very few vegetarians are vegans. Your constant describing them as such is childish.

*Everyone signed, all this after a rather excellent Indian beef curry my wife had dished up.*

A petition eh, Csteele? I remember on one of the ABC Geek programmes,
they did an experiment with petitions. They drew one up to ban water
and make it illegal, most people just signed. How many people
felt strongly enough to turn up yesterday? Bugger all is the reality.

*The export industry needs to take the six months to help the government to get this thing right.*

It will probably take longer then that to sort it out everywhere,
but now that MLA are prepared to spend money on it, we will start to
see solutions. Some of those supply chains are already closed and
ready to go, such as the modern abattoirs in Indonesia who already
use stun guns and put through volume. Shipping no cattle for
6 months would be an absolute disaster, the law of unintended
consequences kicks in. When Northern cattlemen have to get out the
guns to shoot cattle because they have nowhere to go, will those
cameras be there then?

Fact is that if a steer went on a boat tomorrow, it would be three
months before it came out the other side of a feedlot. That is
plenty of time to sort things out. Once again Csteele, good
intentions are not enough. Banning all shipments for 6 months could
actually create a far bigger problem then you have now.

Heres a website where people can vote in support of beef producers

http://www.asbf.com.au/receipt.php#response

I think the Csteele has just shot himself in the foot by admitting
to signing a petition, without the foggiest notion of the
unintended consequences, should it be taken seriously.

Kerryanne,
If you want to promote Halal killing in Aus, or promote more cattle slaughter in Indonesia or Malayasia, then go for it. Right now we have a problem with exporting cattle to Indonesia that requires urgent attention. There is no reason why the government cannot lift the bans to allow some abittoirs in Indonesia to receive our stock. That is the crucial thing at this point. I do not particularly care about the ins and outs of Halal killing, just that the slaughter is done in the best possible way.

I recall debate here on OLO years ago between PALE and others about Halal killing here, and it seems like a war is still going on between animal rights groups about this. Halal killing is being done here now as my local abittoirs carries it out.

Have a look at your last post on page 8 and ask yourself if it makes sense to anyone else reading it.
Posted by Banjo, Sunday, 19 June 2011 9:24:06 AM

Banjo,
Fair enough comment. Yes I can see now the problem. I was speaking in terms behind the problem thinking some would follow- mostly AA friends. So as this is about abattoirs in Indonesia, I am going to do my best to make sense out of the page 8 post you mentioned and BTW apologies i should have stopped to consider others.

- This whole issue with Indonesia is in fact a holy war over Halal accreditation-

The war is to be battled out right here in Australia very soon
( again)

Indonesia you know is a Muslim country. Halal must be eaten. Halal is the way in which an animal is killed. In Indonesia Mr Lukman Hakim from Indonesia’s peak Islamic body, Indonesia Ulema Council (MUI), In Australia in 2003 there were 6 accreditation Authority's- now well over 150. What 1s is really going on -is the usual fight for the Halal accreditation. Its never been more vital. That will be fought here regarding Australian Animals right here shortly. This is why RSPCA, AA have shifted their attention.

*There is no reason why the government cannot lift the bans to allow some abattoirs in Indonesia to receive our stock.*

Here are some of the problems-
At best Indonesia "if we get the best plants operating to humane standards can only handle- around 140 thousand. That leaves over four hundred thousand stuck. Many would have gone into feed lots.

First of all they have to get proper equipment which complies with Halal Accreditation according to "their Halal accreditation's standards.

MLA put the wrong equipment in the better plants but these guys have zero. RSPCA wants animals pre stunned but to many this is haram ( forbidden) So once again it all comes back to which Islamic Council is doing the accreditation's.
Banjo said.
Halal killing is being done here now as my local abattoirs carries it out.

Yes Halal is done here correct. Most animals are pre stun with 90% of Muslims accepting the more humane method of pre stunning.
So in Australia we have far too many Halal certifying bodies which is badly in need of a national accreditation.

It didnt help that the low life MLA introduced their own brand allowing animals to be killed slowly.

So MLA has to go and the primitive imans that are pushing for slaughter without pre stunning not only here but world wide. The OIE need to lift their game.( world Authority animal welfare)

Fact is Indonesia and hundreds of other countries have killed our Australian Animals just like we saw on 4 corners for years and RSPCA AA rightfully oppose it.

The codes were the different Halal accreditation councils- again sorry i should have thought. Trust me its all about Halal accreditation because they dont *want to pre stun.