I hope they bring in the old adultery laws again (as this case concerned two women) Or may be up the "age difference" by 7 years.

Yabby has it right,the sexual drive is part of our very human make up, primitive maybe but it is inherited.
Foxy again has skipped over the fact this girl took two footballers to a toilet block ,had sex with them, and bragged about it days before this event.
C J Morgan our greeny much respected contribitor, finds an extreme conservative stand here.
SEX it exists in all its forms, it is the reason for mental illness, it makes or breaks lives, we can not ignore it has many forms.
I just can not believe some think only their views are right.
Thugby league? just maybe the bias is against the sport not its players?
culture[ sorry about the spelling in last post] its our culture, group sex is no judge of a person.
I focus my dislike on child sex, rape, forced sex but we walk shoulder to shoulder with people who practice forms of sex we must execpt are different.

Foxy:"Matthew Johns was 30 at the time.
The girl was 19.

Matthew Johns - Victim?"

There was no "victim" in what happened. Matthew Johns is a victim of the witchhunt that people like you have been happy to perpetrate.

BTW, under the law, a 19 year old is an "adult", or "woman", not a "girl" - unless uou're advocating that the age of suffrage for women should be raised? Perhaps you're right; this episode has certainly shown that most women don't trust a 19 year old "girl" to be up to the level of judgement required to cast a meaningful vote.

CJMorgan:"overall I think it's a pretty ugly sociocultural phenomenon"

How on Earth do you come to that? There are thousands of kids playing Rugby League every week and hundreds go on to play at first grade level. The vast majority are never in trouble.

Groups of young men, whether footballers, private school boys, church groups, soldiers or any other group you care to name occasionally have some runaway situations where testosterone-fuelled stupidity gets out of hand. It's especially common in groups in which there is a strong group interdependence, such as sporting teams and the military. Do you suggest we get rid of the military because some soldiers do silly things when in company?

The other side of the coin is women in groups, who are just as prone to let their oestrogen run free, with sometimes horrid results. Should we ban netball and stop groups of women congregating in pubs? I know I've been more commonly abused and heckled by women in groups than by men in groups or alone. They don't seem to be aware that they are on the wrong end of a power imbalance, as the grrls brigade seem to be trying to claim.

How much further do you New Wowsers want to take your pturience?

CJMorgan:"we seem to be becoming less civilised"

No, you're just getting older and less tolerant, as we all do to some extent. The Golden Age is always in the past...

Ginx,

Now there are stories coming out about this woman having several liasons with multiple partners, and the one with Johns involved famous personalities, that there is a scam here.

As for her "stress" it is like a drunk saying that one beer got him drunk, and he thinks it was the 7th.

'Just to set the record straight...

Matthew Johns was 30 at the time.
The girl was 19.

Matthew Johns - Victim?

Thanks examinator and CJ for your inputs.'

Hahahahahaha

This really is getting funny. Foxy were you ever a school teacher? I see what you're doing, and I've noticed Fractelle do the same thing, is attempt to 'show them' by praising the 'acceptable' opinions at the end of a topic, while ignoring the 'unacceptable' 'boys club' opinions. i.e. I'm not talking to you anymore because you don't agree with me. Johns was 30, and he had consent, but the average age of a league player is under 25.

It really is starting to become very obvious when the 'girls club' come up against an argument they have no answer to. Praise the people they agree with as being 'reasonable' and 'behaving' like good little boys, issue an edict to the others that "this one shouldn't be responded to",or talk about a 'boys club', or say how they're ignoring the 'abusive' posters. It's all a massive smoke screen to avoid responding to points raised that you have no comeback to. Ginx and Fraccy even admit they either dont read or skim the 'boys club' posts, but then get all upset by them, and complain about being 'dismissed' because they're women.

Then the irony, after attempting to exclude posters who's opinions you don't like, accuse THEM of being a club that is silencing you. Great stuff!

Soooo...

In Foxy/Fractelle style....

I'd just like to end this topic by thanking Antiseptic and Robert for your interesting points, and for entering into the spirit of the discussion. It's a pity that Ginx decided to disrupt the good points about consent with childish 'boys club' abuse.

I think robert said it best 'I can't find a framework to support action based on the idea of wrong in this context that lets me still hold firm to the idea of equality for women. If women of the age of consent are not really able to give consent then what else can't they make decisions about'

It seems that on this thread we're no
closer to understanding the psychology
of group behaviour, including exploitation,
group sex and voyeurism.

Chris Rattue in his article, "Exposure of
sex scandal can only do good," in The
New Zealand Herald, 13 May 2009 sums up
the situation rather well:

"I'm not sure if bad group sex is only a
league specialty in the world of sport, but
I assume it isn't...

Presumably, hordes of eager young blokes realise
they are not about to be ravaged by all of the
Pussycat Dolls plus a couple of their sisters, so
don't bother making that long bus trip to hang
around a hotel lobby in Houston.

Women have every right to hunt down superstars, and
the shagadelic stars can covort as they wish, so
long as it is legal.

But when you throw in all the factors - including
alcohol - grey areas emerge. One, it must be imagined,
is what constitutes consensual sex, as a woman faced
with surprisingly insurmoutable odds may not be
strong enough to reveal her true feelings.

As to the morning after, it is also extraordinarily
difficult to prove that sex wasn't consensual,
especially when the witness list ratio is 10-to-one."

As Rattue says, "It is so difficult for a prosecutor.
Those deemed innocent are not always innocent and
those who escape court appearances should not always
have done so."

I agree with him that, "It is unfair to demonise
sports teams in general because not every player is
tarred with the same brush... there will be those
who do the right thing."

However I agree, "...exposure of the NRL's shame
should make women increasingly aware of the risks,
which might help keep a few of them safe...
However...within their enclaves, these young men
feel invincible...the young women, flirting with
fame, may well feel the same...until they find out
otherwise..."

As Rattue stresses, "At least the issue is out of
the closet."