I just got back and have read the responses.

Ansi I'm not nor was I bent out of shape. I merely pointed out that we were talking on different levels. By that I clearly meant that most of the posts were at the level Romany alluded to. Foxy (to some degree) and I are both looking at it from more personal disengaged level. Not so much of the specifics of this case but from a wider (what does this mean) level i.e. What can we learn from this rather than the specifics of Matt Johns + umpteen others gang banged a girl X.
In that context I answered your question.
Gang bangs/bun are NOT mainstream sexual behaviour and hence they tend to be sensationalised and draw lynch mob behaviour from the masses and media.

Below that level the conversation becomes an exercise in dissonance and a W.O.T.

I rarely get comment at that level all the examples I gave were examples that illustrated the need for a wider perspective.

Again I mentioned the evolutionary 'urges' that is often put as justification for what is simply a lack of self control/common-sense and in doing so reduces sex to its primeval state ignoring the evolved cultural adaptations since. i.e. equating sex as being a part (not necessarily essential) of an affection display. If this wasn't the case masturbation would be as meaningful as copulation and the 'after glow' the sense of well-being and connection. I personally have found that opportunistic (or predatory) one night stands are unsatisfying and and after the flush of hormones 13- 18 ish they held little interest for me.
This may or may not apply to others.

What is clear if you take young impressionable men and women and put them in this pressure cooker of hormonal demand for the extreme then you get ...outside of two standard deviation nominal common sexual practices (statistically).
The solution is more interesting to me.
BTW Belly mum tells me the Sunday Mail leads with another 'alleged sexual misconduct' by footballers

Shadow Minister
I agree with you. We should respect people's privacy.
I DID NOT EXPECT TO SEE CONSERVATIVE PEOPLE WITH OPENED MIND!
Continue to this direction!
I found from this thread that some progresive people are more conservative about the sex and privacy, than the real conservatives.
May be it is better to remove the labels from us and start an open, honest discusion from the begin!
About the sex scandal, I do not think it was any scandal, I think we had to be more fair with the persons involved in the sex and
NOT TO HUMILIATE THEM PUBLICLY.
We should protect people's essencial rights, respect and protect their integrity and do not write comments which could hurt and create problems to them.
Antonios Symeonakis
Adelaide

Aha, the plot thickens!

*But since then the New Zealand Accident and Compensation Commission has made weekly payments to Clare after finding she was suffering from post-traumatic stress disorder and was suicidal.*

http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2008/s2567625.htm

Sounds like they will pay you 80% of your salary for doing nothing,
as long as you can keep convincing them, that you are still
suffering. (That info comes from another NZ website.)

By the sound of things, Clare is still cashing in every week and
will continue to do so, whilst the poor dear remains "stressed".

Ginxy, I seem to remember it was you on another thread, mentioning
ulterior motives?

Sounds like they will keep paying, whilst Clare can convince them
of her "suffering".

Sounds to me more and more, that even the OLO girls club will have
to admit that Mathew Johns was indeed the victim and that the ABC
were perhaps rather gullible in all of this.

Personally, I'd be appalled if either my son or my daughter/s participated in something like the Christchurch 'menage a scrum'. It would say something very distasteful about the values I'd imparted to them as a parent. Frankly, I would be ashamed of them.

However, I acknowledge that there are people out there - male and female - who find such behaviour acceptable or even desirable, and good luck to them as long as they're all consenting adults. They're just not the sort of people I'd have anything to do with, any more than I imagine would most civilised people.

Which is the main point of this brouhaha to me, really. Forget the gender wars for a moment, and consider Yabby's Discovery Channel version of 'biological determinism'. The essence of what he says is reasonably valid, at least in as much as we share various biological imperatives with our genetic relatives. However, what distinguishes us as humans is that we have developed far more elaborate cultures than other animals, and these provide us with not only repositories of knowledge, experience and technology, but also values, morals and rules by which we are able to live lives with each other that are not "nasty, brutish and short", like other animals.

Actually, with the exception of "short", I think that's a pretty good description of Thugby League and its values, actions and culture. There are many good things about the Rugby League subculture, but overall I think it's a pretty ugly sociocultural phenomenon. I also think that the scrutiny it and its players, fans and administration are now receiving in public discourse is probably a good thing.

Paradoxically, we seem to be becoming less civilised despite the breathtaking technological advances of the last century or so. That bothers me even more than stuff like climate change does.

Just to set the record straight...

Matthew Johns was 30 at the time.
The girl was 19.

Matthew Johns - Victim?

Thanks examinator and CJ for your inputs.

Sheesh Foxy, you are a worry, you really are.

Last week we had a story on 4 Corners, about a seemingly gullible
19 year old, who decided to sleep with half a football team and
according the reports, is still cashing in on a weekly basis.

I could be wrong, but you seem to think that age is a excuse.

This week on 4 Corners we have a report of a self appointed guru,
who claims to be the son of god, who landed up sleeping with
7-8 of his female followers, who actually believe him. That it
seems, is just the tip of the iceberg and the females are of
all ages, not just young.

How old do you girls have to be, until we can agree that you
should be responsible for your actions and not use age as
an excuse any more?

I hear no excuses here from the OLO girls club, for the actions
of 19 year old male footballers.