I have come to the conclusion that sheep are always looking for new ways to die. When a sheep decides its time, times up. They just give up and nothing can turn them around. Like yabby says, they are dumb, especially merinos.

This doesnt mean they should be packed on ships though. Its just another arguement against it.

Yes Wendy, I am into sheep.

Wendy you are free to be obsessed about the live trade and claim that things happen which are not reality as we know it. I downloaded the 2005 mortality summary earlier, 36 pages of it, and what is clearly shown is that shy feeders are by far the major cause of deaths on a sheep ship. We get anorexic people who refuse to eat, some sheep too. What those who handle sheep know is that they can be extremely stubborn, merinos being the worst, as they are by far the dumbest. We see that on farms, comparing merino and xbred lambs. What should occur to anyone reading this forum is that if over 99% of sheep, despite the many natural diseases that affect them, despite the shy feeders, still get there fine, many of the conditions that you claim are clearly nonsense!

Yes things used to be bad, but things have changed. Under present conditions, I have yet to see any rational and informed person claim that animals are suffering onboard.

My point is that you animal libbers are putting huge time and energy into ending the live trade. My point is that there is much suffering of animals happening right here in Australia and if you focussed on that suffering and how to end it, you would be doing alot more good then you are doing now, which it seems is not exactly achieving much, just lots of talk.

I came on these forums to support the good people who posted them. God only knows there are two few. This Forum is not the place to get too involved in the work.

Yes yabby Australia needs a huge touch up regarding animal welfare that is true.

Sheep suffer stress and stop eating yup.

Instead of bagging us for our sincere efforts to expand Free Range Farms. Improving animal welfare perhaps you could post just ONE suggestion to help Free Range Farmers.

" Other Than Of Course starting A Free Range Farmers support group to stand up for you all against the extreme groups.' Which we have already made a good start on.

We have made a stand against! extreme groups "supporting farmers."

Its A first in this country and LONG overdue!

They are the ones who have NOW started posting BUY FREE RANGE but refuse the HELP Free Range Farmers!

Until somebody gets some funds to build more Free Range Farms abattoirs telling everybody to buy free range is a joke! because they are not enough to supply to stores.

I guess the extreme lot at least now saying buy Free range Is A start Ah.
It seems we have done some good after all pig farmer

We work in conjunction with RSPCA QLD and are blessed to have a decent man Mark Townend who has worked to improve animal welfare.

I would have thought Free Range Farmers would be happy to get any support.
However! if You Do not Wish To be Seen working with us thats ok we will find others.

As for being after your biz pig farmer I find that quite extrordinary.
Just for the record I could never take one cent of blood money from killing animals.
That is my PERSONAL veiw.
Even The Company is set up with overseas investors to donate a percentage back into animal welfare.

Other than Office costs and out goings NOT ONE CENT GOES TO ME! because I DONT WANT IT

Wendy, you lose me sometimes. Did anyone accuse you of taking donated funds?

How wrong are you about real support for free range farmers? I will tell you.

Firstly, Animals Aust have been running the http://www.savebabe.com.au campaign for over twelve months and encourage people to buy free range. It had nothing to do with you.

Tomorrow we will have an inspector from RSPCA head office here for our accreditation – you see RSPCA are, and have been for a while now, supporting free range and welfare friendly pork. http://www.rspca.org.au/food/overview.asp

The Humane Society have developed the new Humane Choice label. They are so committed to its implementation that they have handed the administration of it to NASAA, an independent organic certifier with no affiliation to any animal welfare groups. (meaning there are no hidden agendas like vegeterianism) This standard, when compared to the welfare aspects of the organic standard, is almost identical. This label has been in the pipeline and in the media for a while. It is now at the stage of accrediting farms and promoting the label to wholesalers and major supermarkets. Voiceless also donated $20,000 towards its implimentation.
http://www.hsi.org.au/news_library_events/Humane%20Choice/Standards/Humane_Choice_Standards_Feb_06_specifics_Pigs.pdf#search=%22humane%20choice%22

So you see Wendy, you are very out of touch with the very thing you say you are helping. It would also help if you read the posts thru before you over reacted.

You are not the first to want to help free range farmers, people are already doing it.

So, here is my ‘one suggestion for helping free range farmers’ - The Humane Choice label is very exciting and will bring pork, poultry, beef and lamb under the one free range umbrella and administrated by an independent, professional organization that has no ties to animal welfare groups. Finally there will be a standard to reassure consumers. It is my recommendation that farmers join this label. http://www.nasaa.com.au

I do appreciate the effort you put in to live exports but the free range farmer issue needs a little more finesse.

Pigfarmer
I was in the office when your email arrived with a copy of a letter you had received from Animals Australia.
I posted that copy because I felt everybody should know how badly Free Range Farmers are treated especially by so called Animal Welfare Groups.
I didnt know your name came up but so what.
Look who is calling the kettle black. You send us their private email also, so tell me what is the difference.

Also I was here when Wendy called you and you said it was fine.

NASSAA and the Humane Society are people we have worked with for a long time together with RSPCA QLD. You should read the web pages first. See from our HKM web page >

Dr. Ameer Ali
President
The Australian Federation of Islamic Councils (AFIC) has had 41 proud years as Australia's only Islamic peak body.

Mr Amjad Mehboob
Amjad Mehboob is the CEO Chief Executive AFIC

Mr Mark Townend

Mr Mark Townend is the CEO of RSPCA QLD
Supporting Free Range Farms in place of Live Exports

P O Box 439
Avalon NSW 2107
Australia
Telephone: (02) 9973 1728
Facsimile: (02) 9973 1729
Email enquiry@hsi.org.au
Website: www.hsi.org.au

Thursday, 5 January 2006

“ Humane Society International is in full support of the HKM, PALE, AFIC initiative to create a more humane life for farm animals and to improve slaughter techniques. The establishment of Humane Halal abattoirs is a giant step in the right direction. We look forward to an opportunity to work with them in the future to achieve these goals.”

Verna Simpson – Director – Humane Society International

I can Not believe somebody contacted the OLO editor asking wendy To be Banned from making comments because she used Capitals,

To be honest I do Not Know what the Problem is however we will work to continue supporting the free range farmers who are happy to receive help.
Clearly You dont want our support so that is noted and respected.
Please however do not email us privately.
That way everybody can get on with their work including yourself.

Run out of posts Wendy? Using another user name? Who really knows! You cannot be trusted.
"however dont email us directly" You email, phone and harrass people when your solicitation are univited.

You have just admitted that you will use people to serve your own agenda. In the beginning I did think you were sincere and emailed you (not PALE, not anyone else) once PRIVATELY with my concern about the vegetarian views of AA. I said it was OK?? My words words were, I cringed when I read it! I am glad I had never sent you anything else. Now that email is plastered on a public forum that you do not have the decency to remove.

Let this be a warning to all that deal with PALE.
You have lost the plot wendy.