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The Forum > General Discussion > Is not Allowing Ukraine to join NATO the right decision?

Is not Allowing Ukraine to join NATO the right decision?

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Well said David. What's more, AC puts a great deal of effort into thinking about things, expressing his ideas and answering questions, which I find commendable.

We all see the world a little differently and that is the fun of olo for me. The events in Ukraine will not alter a jot for all our comments here.
Posted by Fester, Sunday, 23 July 2023 8:20:23 PM
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What these cluster bombs the Ukies are using on civillian areas?
http://twitter.com/squatsons/status/1682789691333185536
I heard 5 kids have been critically wounded so far.
If that's what excites you, each to their own I suppose

Maybe this strike from a Geran kamikaze UAV at the ammunition depot in Chudnov, Zhytomyr region two days ago is what gets yoou toey.
http://twitter.com/squatsons/status/1682476966149251074

"And Russia can't even protect a bridge 200km from the front line or their ammo dumps that have been exploding spectacularly."
Hmmm, you mean the husband and wife that went to Crimea on a day trip to get out of all the attacks in their hometown Belgorod?
The one that left their young daughter orphaned and critically injured with severe head injuries?
- Hardly anything to boast about.
http://twitter.com/snekotron/status/1680967604792442880/photo/1

Maybe when Ukraine blew up the Mariupol Drama theatre full of women kids and elderly and blamed it on Russia you considered that a bigger win?

"In short, the war for the Russians is not sustainable and they will lose."
- Must be really hard lying to yourself in the face of evidence to the contrary. I know you all support Ukraine and are struggling to cope with Ukraines inability to push back the Russians, who hold 100,000 square kilometers of previously Ukrainian territory, and even the Kiev Post lays out the poor military morale situation and military shortages they face.

Heres some quick videos so you can catchup
Russians with a captured Bradley, does morale seem low to you?
http://twitter.com/cmd_exee/status/1679484918538317825
"Patriot fires 35 missiles into fake targets"
http://twitter.com/MyLordBebo/status/1678731224955625474
"We want them to come faster to feck them up"
http://twitter.com/MyLordBebo/status/1682374121949216769

Listen CAREFULLY
http://twitter.com/squatsons/status/1678837530446426112

Where's your secondhand end of life F-16's?
http://twitter.com/Blackrussiantv/status/1679473814822961160

Here's the Ukrainians in action
http://twitter.com/MyLordBebo/status/1679802361546514432

Don't forget your successful counter-offensive LOL
http://twitter.com/OlgaBazova/status/1680285021934960641

Oh and btw, unconfirmed reports
UKRAINIAN LINES COLLAPSED AT KARMAZYNIVKA (Svatove Front)
- Russia on verge of a breakthru to Oskil River
http://youtu.be/vTTxcfKAmqA

Raytheon Calls in Retirees to Help Restart Stinger Missile Production
http://www.defenseone.com/business/2023/06/raytheon-calls-retirees-help-restart-stinger-missile-production/388067/
Posted by Armchair Critic, Sunday, 23 July 2023 9:17:19 PM
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Foxy,

The only thing the Russians do well is lie, and AC is a fast study.

I am enjoying watching the Ukrainians turn Russian weapons into scrap and Russian soldiers into compost.

At the end of this conflict, Russia will probably be a third-world country.

Russia is losing this war.
Posted by shadowminister, Monday, 24 July 2023 4:18:36 AM
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"I (SM) am enjoying watching the Ukrainians turn..... Russian soldiers into compost."

Says it all, a warmongering Trumpster who gets his kicks out of other peoples misery. You must have had much enjoyment in your lifetime watching others suffer and die in such a way.

p/s What is your history of military involvement? None I suspect.
Posted by Paul1405, Monday, 24 July 2023 5:15:29 AM
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shadowminister wrote:

"I am enjoying watching the Ukrainians turn Russian weapons into scrap and Russian soldiers into compost."

Aren't Russian soldiers human? Don't Russian parents grieve? Which army you are in generally depends on which side of the border you live on.

Do you also hope you will see somebody burn to death in a car accident?
Posted by david f, Monday, 24 July 2023 7:27:26 AM
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I've made a policy of not making predictions about the outcome of the war of the Russian Steppes, neither as to the ultimate outcome nor as to the current nuisances of individual battles or 'pushes'.

The notion that anyone can read various twitter feeds or Telegram posts and get a handle on what's really going on is, in my view, bonkers. But people pick their favoured side and then burrow through the WWW looking for unverifiable claims that support their 'side'. As with most wars, the 'experts' have been pretty much wrong throughout, from the initial thinking that the Russians would just roll over the Ukrainian army to thinking the current Ukrainian push would achieve various break-throughs.

Studying history and the history of war shows that the fog of war is impenetrable, even for experts.....indeed, especially for experts.

So the war drags on and anyone who tells you they know how it will finish, is just blowing smoke.

But we can draw some conclusions. As I've said elsewhere, the Russian have already lost as regards their main war aim - keeping NATO at arms length. NATO is now stronger than ever with the addition of Sweden and especially Finland and is now very much not at arms length. Even if Putin does cause the total collapse of the Ukrainian forces and takes whatever he desires of their territory, post-war Russia will be a diminished entity as compared the pre-war Russia.

For what it's worth, my own guess is that the Russians who are, as usual, quite prepared to spend the blood of their youth in profligate sums, will finally wear down the Ukrainian will to resist as well as the west's will to assist. Nations who are prepared to sacrifice their youth is unlimited quantities, as Russia always has, generally win wars but fail to prosper. That's Russia's fate.

Perversely the likely big winner out of all this may turn out to be Poland who are likely to have the biggest, best equipped army in Europe by war's end and, should Ukraine collapse, will take western Ukraine into their embrace.
Posted by mhaze, Monday, 24 July 2023 9:55:52 AM
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