Islam does have a problem with a radical element but not all Muslims have been radicalised. The vast majority are law abiding. Tarring all with the same brush is akin to them characterising us as all beer-swilling yobbos. Which they do.

There is a Christian element which takes the bible literally and thinks humanity is reaching the 'end times'. Harmless enough until you consider many actually look forward to it and do their utmost to bring it about.

Why modify my wasteful lifestyle in order to save the planet when God will provide? Why try to bring about peace in the middle east when an all-out war is foretold in the prophecies and is actually desirable? Why extend tolerance to other faiths when I know I'm right and you're wrong?

Phooey to the fundies here on OLO and elsewhere.

Mil Observer...I've seldom seen such undulterated rubbish put forward so elequently. Your eloquence is only exceeded by your abject lack of understanding and prominence as a verbose dill of the highest order :) Now..that's not an ad hominem..its a raw rubber meets the road fact, and if I have to prove it to your face..I'm happy to do so.

The most dangerous part of your posts was that (like any good propoganda) they contain just enough truth to sound plausible.

There are so many issues in your various paragraphs which defy the word and post limit here that it isn't even worth persuing.

If you want to meet up some time, we can disuss all that at length.

"CORRECTIVE ACTION ALERT" - ie.Mil-Observer needs serious counselling and deprogramming/demythologizing.

Dear BUSHBASHER.. I guess that last post was aimed at me.

I absolutely recommend not Froggies LAST sentence to you, but his FIRST (and to Mil-Lackof-Observer also.)

Understand THAT and you and LACKofOBERVER will both understand what the Christian lobby is about in regard to Islam. It might also help (dare I say it) to read.. actually read...

Surah 19:88-92 (about Christians) (scroll to the verse)

http://www.islamicity.com/mosque/QURAN/19.htm

Surah 9:30 (about Christians and Jews)

http://www.islamicity.com/mosque/QURAN/9.htm (scroll to the verse)

Then...when you couple those to Froggies sentence.. aaaaH enLIGHTenment has come upon you... Nirvanah even.

PS.... did anyone else hear it? the silly little CHIRPING BIRD which freaaaaaked me out from my speakers.. from the ADVERT at the top banner.

gee. i suggest maybe we actually should discuss the islamic women's report that no one can seem to find, and see what the evidence is. froggie immediately whines that i'm deluded and that i should do some research.

and boaz simply ignores all responses, too much in a rush to continue picking his nose.

i've had enough.

katieo, you have more class than this. i suggest you distance yourself from these decidedly unchristian lowlifes.

bushbasher,
Keysar Trads article was really in response to 'The age' story about the report by the Islamic Womens Council.

There is not much purpose in discussing it further until the Government releases the report which,I think, they commisioned.

I certainly will be keeping an eye out for this to happen and when it does I, if nobody else does, will introduce the contents for discussion.

bennie has a very good point.

Fundamentalism is fundamentalism. We may be surprised at how chillingly undemocratic and inhumane a society not "engineered" by tolerance, equality and human rights, but biblically correct would be.

Christian fundamentalists have certainly undermined democratic values and promoted divisiveness. "Controversies" have been invented where there are none. Scientific interpretations and science itself attacked for no other reason than belief is evidence free.

Scripture has been used to justify violence, war, social/economic problems and climate change. 'Creation science' single handedly made Panda's a little less cute and people more confused. Biotechnology, public health, progressive policy, free choice...

Perhaps limiting expressions of fundamental belief, particularly within education would benefit mainstream religions, and us all, in the long run.

banjo, i agree. i wasn't trying to be cute. i'm no fan of trad, and i'm no fan of cultural autonomy as an excuse for nastiness. we'll see what comes.

i was trying to distinguish a real debate with real evidence, from the nasty content-free self-indulgent guilt-by-association unchristian nonsense of boaz and tang and froggie.