Froggie: << ...alien totalitarian and fascist movement otherwise known as a religion called Islam >>

So Islam is the religion of the Klingons?

Actually, if Froggie is really the atheist s/he claims to be, s/he'd recognise that Islam comes from almost exactly the same Earthly source as do Christianity and Judaism, i.e. the myths and legends of various Semitic pastoralist tribes who inhabited what is now the Middle East some millennia ago.

The reason they all apparently hate each other so much is that they still compete for the same territory, both in the physical and ideological senses of the term, that they always have.

Mr Periwinkle said:

“The forty million who died between 1914 and 1918, thanks to some folk "upholding the values of the West" might just have an argument with you, I suspect.”

So what you are saying, Mr Periwinkle, is that we should have let Germany take over the whole of Europe in 1914?

http://www.firstworldwar.com/origins/causes.htm

And again Mr Periwinkle says:

“Then there were the - oh yes - seventy million who were victims of the same upholding of Western values between 1939 and 1945.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Causes_of_World_War_II

So again, Mr Periwinkle, according to you we should have said, OK Hitler, take over the whole of Europe and we’ll join you in making war against your enemies the Bolshevists. Let the Japanese take over Asia and let Germany and Japan share the world between them.

Mr Periwinkle, your words are an insult to all the people who died defending freedom.

Go and live in a more enlightened place like Pakistan or Saudi Arabia.

As for that ludicrous link to some Indian travel site, I really can’t be bothered trying to dissuade you from your delusions.

The reason I dislike Islam so intensely is that it is against all the principles that are part of Australia:
(from the Department of Immigration’s web site)

What are the Australian values?
Australian values include:
* respect for the freedom and dignity of the individual
* equality of men and women
* freedom of religion
* commitment to the rule of law
* support for Parliamentary democracy
* a spirit of egalitarianism that embraces mutual respect, tolerance, fair play, compassion for those in need and pursuit of the public good
* equal opportunity for individuals, regardless of their race, religion or ethnic background

Although these values may be expressed differently by different people, their meaning stays the same. The values may not be unique to Australia, but they have broad community agreement and underpin Australian society and culture.

Islam is at odds with these values: plenty of links have been given by other posters about this, but you and C J Morgan are determined to ignore them.
continued...

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You are correct that in practical terms, Islamic terrorism has not been very effective, and even compared to say, the road toll, has not killed that many people.

What I am really concerned about is the insidious rise of Islam in our country, and its potential to take away all the freedoms we have fought for over the centuries.

Freedom of religion includes, to me at least, the right not to be religious, and regardless of what you may think, I am definitely not religious.

Dear Dreamy.. this thread has turned seriously surreal wouldn't you agree ? :) we have this cultural/linguistic side discussion between us, and me firing off a few pot shots at Pericles here and there.. Him and Foggie croaking at each other in blunt tones.. Pericles trying to sound elitist/intellectual and relevant but struggling as the truth is brought to bear on his 'unusual' slant on things...ahh.. good entertainment for sure :)

So.. I'll leave Pericles to Froggie and focus on you.

What the heck are you doing in Indo ? I'm most curious now.

Your responses show just how colorful and rich is the (to use my opponents words) tapestry of culture, language and life in South East Asian.. aah.. so romantic to be sure.

Here is something you can probably identify with...

There is this American, he is like 65ish.. got with a local girl, and built this cool round house in 'a location' among my wifes people.. and continued to live the life of a kind of soldier of personal fortune as he flitted back and forth between Brunei (oil industry related work) and Sarawak (for women related work) he is such a dill.
She gets pregnant....oh happy day..but HE has long had a vasectomy ! Oooops!.. well.. they split up.. then he hooks up with this INCREDIBLY gorgeous Javanese girl he met at some factory in Sabah... who can't speak English..and he can't speak Indo/Malay..
Ayyyoh.. he goes into town for regular booze ups..and rips into her for not wanting to join him in that kind of life. Then he beats her up with a pillow etc when he comes back drunk.

She has muslim background, but gravitates so much to the warmth of the Christianity of my wifes people, who accept and embrace her as a friend.

Nice tap dancing, Froggie.

Pity about those two left feet.

>>So what you are saying, Mr Periwinkle, is that we should have let Germany take over the whole of Europe in 1914?<<

You were talking about "upholding the values of the West".

Right?

I simply pointed out that WWI was fully representative of those values

Since when did Germany become Oriental? They were a living example of an upright, mostly Roman Catholic population. How do you possibly determine that they did not represent Western values?

Likewise 1939-45. Those Prussians, I'm sure, were just a bunch of closet Islamists really, according to you.

>>As for that ludicrous link to some Indian travel site...<<

Indian travel site? The only link I posted was http://birmingham999.co.uk/ which was there to enlighten you on the topic of religiously-motivated attacks against random civilians.

I'd be a little more careful what you put into that herbal tea, if I were you.

>>What I am really concerned about is the insidious rise of Islam in our country, and its potential to take away all the freedoms we have fought for over the centuries.<<

That much is obvious.

What I am "really concerned about" is that your extremist views are part of the problem, not part of the solution.

>>Freedom of religion includes, to me at least, the right not to be religious, and regardless of what you may think, I am definitely not religious.<<

Then stop acting as if you were a fully paid-up member of the Untied Church of Radical Evangelists.

The task of atheists is to put religion into a proper perspective, not blow it up into a finely-tuned script for an apocalyptic disaster movie.

Keysar Trad: "Let us try to put things into perspective".

Keysar,
If you know the true nature of Islam, then you won't write a silly article that defends Islam in the first place.

Islam is based on Mohammed's lies.

Mohammed spent more than 20 years conquering and forcibly convert people to his religion. Once a 'critical mass' of followers is established, the fellowship became 'self-replicating' and un-stoppable. Muslims parents producing many baby Muslims who grow up to be Muslims parents themselves, and reproducing...

There are over a million believers flocking to Mecca during a haj every time. How many of them will ever stop to critically think how the religion Islam has come about?

What is more important, if one is to put things in perspective?