Callie
I was trying to make the point that a religious belief is categorically different from day-to-day beliefs/opinions. A religion that has a particular omnipotent god as its central belief simply cannot live side by side without friction with a religion that has another equally omnipotent god as its centre. The worship of any such 'god' is ipso facto exclusive of other modes of 'god' worship, and in many different religions (notably today that hodge-podge of twelth century nonsense known as islam) that exclusion, in the hands disenfranchised and ignorant followers, is amplified into intolerance and ultimately violence. As to your vision of a social order without religion, I couldn't agree more - I would only say that, whilst the notion is by no means new, John Lennon beat both of us to the point.
As to BOAZ-David, I am indifferent to the alleged rantings and musings of a sun-struck professional sado-masochist who 'saw the light'and became the first professional evangelical pulpit thumper in a long line that has led us to the like of Oral Roberts, Benny Hinn et al, except to note that it would seem the Freudian coping strategy known as 'reaction formation' was alive and well long before Freud came onto the scene. Present day courtrooms are full of similar 'conversions' and it is sad to note that people who should know better still fall for it and many brutal criminals escape justice by similar pleadings. Tell it to the Balkan states christian militias, or the various inquisitions, or the witch burners, or any number of rabid fundamentalist christian sects, etc etc.

Strayan, thanks for the New Matilda website. Though not of Lebanese heritage or Muslim, really identified with the story your link sent me to. I've been in Australia for 30 years too and relate exactly to what he said

For Logic, British colonialists having left the Stone Age before arriving in Australia had no desire to revert back to darkness by assimilating into the Stone Age.

Peppy. Yesterday’s news featured a report of a large Turkish demonstration protesting the possibility of a Muslim state.

Turkish-Kurdish Clashes in Brussels, 02 Apr 2007 another riot & community centre burnt. Article mentions thirty thousand dead in recent times.

September 24, 2006, Turkish tanks in Kurdistan. A new Middle East war is in the offing. DEBKAfile’s exclusive military sources in Iraq and sources in Iran reveal that Turkish and Iranian air units as well as armoured, paratroops, etc -- the synopsis was intelligence reports were that Iran and Turkey were poised to cooperatively attack Kurdistan. Yes it didn't happen, but this does not prove it was not being planned. Now the US Democrats may assist forward planning by scheduling a withdrawal from Iraq.

The tactic of emotively denouncing someone else by feigning outrage and labelling them racist is becoming very tedious. The additional tactic of arguing that a point of view lacks merit due to the lack of detail is another transparent tactic especially useful when OLO posts have a word limit.

Assuming Peppy is not being obtuse, -- Turkey is not some benign enlightened state. Nazis, Khu Klux Klan, still have adherents and presumably dangerous organisations exist in Turkey.

Aquavarius quote. "There are only a very minority of Australian Muslims who want to be identified as Islamic first and foremost." It was reported on a recent ABC interview that 30% of British Muslims wish to have an Islamic state replace democracy.

When are we going to debunk the naive assumption that the radical minority equals 2% or less. People who live in several key western suburbs of Sydney already know the bogus contentions of the academic elite in reference to the purported "small minority". Remember the jubilation of certain ethnic cab drivers as the 9/11 news broke?

If OLO writers really desire accuracy they should change the PC mantra to the "minority of about 30%".

I think everyone is patently aware of the shortcomings of Christians just as we are aware of the shortcomings of humanity in general.

It would be beneficial if people were to refrain from deriding Christians and their history in a vain attempt to prove that the present danger of Radical Islam is largely paranoia.

At least the true believers in Jones Town poisoned themselves instead of choosing suicidal bombings of civilians.

Cowboy Joe, Your wasting your post on Peppy. That person cut and pasted from Leighs post, "And so the ignorance continues." and built a defence of Islam on racism. And labeled Leigh a racist. Islam does not equal race.
From my post Peppy chose, “In my opinion and experience there are two types of immigrants.“ Then accused me of making the assertion that I know all about the workings of the minds of every Muslim. Peppy's defence for such poor comprehension of the written word is "I base my previous accusation that some people post Racist comments on this site on the fact that they engage in classic Racist rhetoric and stereotyping." By which my post becomes stereotypically racist.
In my next post I say, “I can only imagine what is going through the minds of Muslims born and raised in Australia.” From which Peppy takes this brief snippet and declares, "You seem to think you can read the minds of all the Muslims born and raised in Australia." The most liberal interpretation does not take one to that end.

Now. From my post you select, "There are only a very minority of Australian Muslims who want to be identified as Islamic first and foremost." And then bring in British Muslims and a poll that suggest all things being equal 30% of British Muslims want Sharia. While I believe that number is a very liberal assessment I do believe that since OBL has defeated the "West" many western born Muslims have climbed on the radical band wagon. However, I think this is more displaced loyalties thanks to the preaching of these self proclaimed Imams who have an interpretation of Islam not practiced by the majority. And certainly not the Islam expressed by the 100 signatories of the open letter to the Pope.

Here is a link to a downloadable PDF copy.

http://www.islamicamagazine.com/issue18/openletter18_lowres.pdf

Leigh,
you are right. "so the ignorance continues"

Imran Lum a PhD Candidate? He won't pass with this type of article. So much basicly wrong it would have to be torn up if presented as an essay.

Lum is the one who bundles all muslims together and attempts to compare them with nationalities.

Irfan Yusuf says Lebanese muslims are the highest population of muslims in Aus, so i wonder if Peppy has considered the possibility that his claim of Turks may be wrong?

It seems to me that muslims, in general, are integrating and we are having problems with, mainly, one group. Lebanese muslims have an anti social attitude and arrogance that prevents them from integrating. They display disdain for us, our culture, our laws and social standards.

I have not seen or heard of many problems with muslims of other nationalities. Only a few, mainly minor and infrequent.

Unfortunately, for many years the actions of the Lebs has greatly tarnished the image of all muslims in Aus.

The way to correct this is not through anti discriminatory legislation, on religion, but for muslims themselves to lay the blame for local problems right where they belong, with the Lebs.

I wonder why we are so reluctant to admit that Leb muslims are incompatable with our society. The cultural evidence has been in front of us for years. The same cultural problems are there, even three generations later.