Hello PF et al - PF, it's great to see you are considerng sharing your wealth of knowledge out there. NCCAW is the National Consultative Committee for Animal Welfare, and you can find more information on the website of the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Forestry (is that the right way round?) If you do a search for Dept Agriculture Australia you'll find it, then go to animal health and welfare link. It comprises people from farming lobbies, government entities, and "animal welfare representatives" - I think Glenys is on it still, and Hugh Wirth(less) used to be before he was moved on (that's so they can say they "consulted widely with animal welfare representatives" - who are usually totally outnumbered. It seems to be meeting at about six monthly intervals in recent times. Its reports are available at that website too. Hope that's helpful...and I agree with you about the limitation to two posts.
Nicky

Hello Everybody

Yabby I have taken your advise and started another thread dedicated to finding Alternatives to Live exports. It said it can take up to 24hrs so keep an eye out.
I agree PF knows how- but we must make sure PF has the support to go along with that.
As usuaul Celiva you have raised good points. I cant say I agree with intensive people requiring 'insentive' to convert to Free Range however. Its not open for debate. Free Range Celivia is just another word for common decency. The idea of assisting people to divert or start new Free Range piggeries PF had is a good one. Your idea Celiva to open a public trust fund to improve conditions is also good. The Christmas card idea was meant to be in the form of emails. Something that each customer can pick the subject line ,ie order for Christmass Ham etc. That way they will have! to go though each email. Cards are easily thrown in a bin.-' Not enough inconveince'. Save the trees and email them "through to their orders department". These big stores must be made accountable. If they said to the cruel intensive insentive people- yo divert to free Range or we will introduce our own Farms it would happen rather quickly.

Nicky rightfully raised the issue of the fact according to our shameful laws the only had to enlargen the pens by few centmeters. She has a good point and I am sure the public wont settle for that. I guess a one only offer to the intensive people and Woolworths - let us have you to divert to free range or we will do our own.

Nicky perhaps you could speak to your comrades.?

I see we have a new poster Welcome Holy.
PF I agree about the two threads only and I noticed when I applied for the new thread it said two only as well. I must have missed something because wasn't it always four posts every twenty four hours? Does anybody know why its now two?

I agree - free range IS basically common decency, and does not deserve incentives to be paid for it. I think part of the problem is the management and staff of the supermarkets; God knows how they train these people, but if you ask for free range anything they just look blank. They are totally clueless. Persuading them to push for change from the bottom up would also help. It's the same if you ask whether cosmetics and other household type products have been tested on animals.
It follows therefore that there has to be absolute truth in labelling (some things that claim not to be tested on animals, for example, may have had ingredients tested on them, or may not have been tested in Australia but have been somewhere overseas).
One idea might be to get stickers about intensive pig farming which people can slip onto intensively farmed ham and pork in the supermarkets refrigerators - it's not difficult to do if you're quick and unobstrusive, and/or have people outside supermarkets with flyers. PF, do you have any ideas for us here?
I don't know how it became two posts in 24 hours, I'm afraid - I found this months ago, then came back again recently.

I know I am harping on about the AA campaign, but they have a great set of free postcards to send out to supermarkets, food outlets etc. They are very well done. Just go to the pledge page http://www.savebabe/pledge and get them sent out. There is a set of flyers also. They have done that part of the work already. Coming up to xmas is a great time to be sending them out. Antje, the email idea is a great one too. I wouldnt be surprized if AA had something on their site, I will have a look.

Nicky - what a sneaky idea with the stickers! Love it. Remember those store cameras though.

This thread started as an article thats why it only has 2 posts. Antje did you start yours in articles or general?

Yes an excellent idea about the emails, Antje, I will do that.
And Nicky's idea is great too. I did something similar with the caged eggs. Everytime I go to the supermarket I open a few (4 or 5) boxes of eggs to put in a note.
In the free range boxes I say: "Thank you from the chickens for choosing free range eggs".
In the caged boxes I say: "You can change the lives of chickens by buying free range next time you shop".

Yes the rules must have changed for starting a new general discussion. Two posts per 24 hours.

The rules for starting a new general discussion:

* Do not divert article discussions into general discussion threads. (I suppose that means we can't transfer posts from this discussion to a new one).

* Ensure that the discussion you are about to start does not already exist elsewhere under a different name, or filed under a different category.

* Moderators review all discussions before they are posted to the site. Our moderators reserve the right to reject any threads that are deemed inappropriate without notice or explanation.

* Maximum of 2 new threads in any given 24 hour period.

* Comments cannot be longer than 350 words.

* Please observe all Forum Rules.

* Any URLs you type will automatically be converted to hyperlinks

Sorry people I made a mistake- the 'two per 24 hours' rule is for new threads.

It still says you can make 4 posts per article:

* Maximum of 10 posts in any given 24 hour period.

* No more than 4 posts per article in any given 24 hour period.

* Comments cannot be longer than 350 words.

Sorry for the confusion.