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The Forum > Article Comments > Israel should be given the South African treatment > Comments

Israel should be given the South African treatment : Comments

By Antony Loewenstein and Moammar Mashni, published 1/3/2011

Initiatives by Sydney city councils to run a BDS campaign against Israel should be supported.

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Dear Yuyutsu ,
"Genesis 18 , verses 18-23"
A bible discussion with me would get us nowhere ,except to disclose the differing schools of bible construction upon which we respectively rely to support our conclusions .
You would not enjoy it either because my standard of bible studies is very ordinary .
"..same delaying factor.."
An additional & overlaying delaying factor is , I think , the fact that the ordinary citizen will eventually get sick of BDS , & start sending clear messages to the politicians .
On the other hand , the settlers , with their history of fanaticism , might NEVER respond, Might even ENJOY fighting to the last man .
Posted by Oz, Sunday, 13 March 2011 8:50:57 PM
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(cont)
"America ...yield sooner to my milder approach"
The US could refuse to do even that - they have domestic votes to secure , & international face to save (remember the obscene dithering during the Vietnam war ?)
Too late to wait for them to get their act together . That might never happen . And , for every day delayed , the US (& others) will smile wider .
"..Screwdriver/hammer.."
This is a hammer situation , or my name is not Oz .
"Wedge"
Good luck Yuyutsu .
Posted by Oz, Sunday, 13 March 2011 8:59:55 PM
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Dear Oz,

Please forget for a moment that the passage was taken from the bible. It was never my intention to try to impress some authority upon you, but rather to present an interesting early text that deals with the moral issue of collateral damage.

You can divide the Israeli population quite roughly into 3 groups:

A. The settlers and their supporters. They indeed will never respond and would rather die than give up their "promised" land. These are about 30% of Israelis, but their relative numbers are increasing.
B. The peace camp (including Arab Israelis), which ALREADY sends clear messages of disgust, but to no avail: the politicians just ignore and laugh at them (because they know that their portion of the population is decreasing, due to emigration and lower birth-rates). These are about 40% of Israelis, but on the decrease.
C. The security-minded who are in coalition with the settlers because they are afraid for their lives and do not trust that the Arabs either desire peace or are able to maintain any peace agreement. They will bend if only you are able to convince them that they can survive without the settlers. These are about 30% of Israelis.

Your mission, our mission, is to place a wedge between group C and group A, meanwhile avoiding hardship and desperation in group B from either pushing them into the arms of group A as well; or otherwise escaping the country, leaving all their wealth and weapons behind to the settlers and flooding the world as refugees.

Group C is represented by Israel's PM, Netanyahu. He is an opportunist. His rhetoric changes depending whom he is talking with. Being a spoiled brat, inconveniences can easily shake him, but too harsh a pressure would rather bring him to adopt that message which the settlers constantly pump at him: "You see, the whole world is against us, always were, always will, they always just wanted to kill all the Jews and here they are doing it again, so let's stand together, pick up arms and show them the last battle".
Posted by Yuyutsu, Sunday, 13 March 2011 10:00:01 PM
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Re "your/our mission is... ": I don't see where ventilations about such 'mission statements' could come from, if not from rather infantile sources. To me, with respect, this is a lot of leftist pontification about issues most commentators here display an utter want of historical and/or political knowledge. The horizon of those commentators appears limited to leftist kumbaja, Hamas/Fatah launched propaganda, the aping of PLO-planted factoids and a general dislike of the existence of the one Jewish homeland. A democratic and free country in which 20 per cent of the population is Muslim/Arab with full political, legal and media representation, no matter their gender or sexual orientation. Fact remains the lands to the west of river Jordan are Israel by any measure. If you believe this is 'occupied' land, then you probably also believe that Tibetans occupy Chinese lands. Right?
Posted by Raoul, Monday, 14 March 2011 8:21:02 AM
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You may not read this in your leftist MSM:

13MAR11: Hamas handed out candy last night as residents took to the streets of the southern Gazan city of Rafah to celebrate the brutal terror attack in Itamar, where five members of a single Israeli family were murdered in their home, including three children, one of whom was three years old, and another just one month. An 11-year old boy was killed as he lay reading in bed. The children and baby had their throats slit. Three other children who survived are now orphaned.
Hamas Spokesperson Sami Abu Zuhri, welcomed the attack. Fatah’s military wing – the al-Aqsa Martyrs’ Brigades – claimed responsibility for the attack.

There are photos here (sent with the permission of the grandparents who want the world to know).

They have given permission to news media to use them.

WARNING: graphic shots of children
https://picasaweb.google.com/picsyesha/Itamar

PALESTINIAN PRIME MINISTER ADMITS ITS TERRORISM - BUT THE BBC DOESN’T

Even though many Western media failed to report the attack at all, and those that did (such as the BBC) refused to use the word “terror”,

Palestinian Prime Minister Salam Fayyad said he “clearly and firmly denounces this terror attack.”

“ABBAS ENCOURAGES ATTACKS OF THIS KIND”

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu expressed anger that Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas of Fatah (the benefactor of endless goodwill and billions of dollars from the US, European and other governments) refused to properly and swiftly condemn the terror attack.

Netanyahu called upon Abbas to curb the dehumanization of Jews in the Palestinian media and schoolbooks “once and for all”.

The Palestinian Authority continues to lionize Palestinian suicide bombers in its media and at schools, and name public squares after them, and Israel argues that this only serves to encourage attacks like the one perpetrated in Itamar...
Posted by Raoul, Monday, 14 March 2011 8:32:06 AM
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"Hamas handed out candy last night"

Be sure that the settlers are dancing too (in secret of course) for the baby's murder which ended the recent drought.

Settlers feed on such murders, for them it's a small price to pay for what they believe will bring their Messiah over. Netanyahu just promised them permits for 500 new homes in exchange, while the interior-minister, Ely Yishai claimed that it would not be enough, that they should receive 1000 per person murdered, that is 5000 new homes in total. I am sure that if a n angel came down from heaven and offered to bring that murdered family back to life, they would all say "No thanks, we rather hav e our building permits".

You see, Oz, the settlers are not alarmed in the least by your suggestions for blanket BDS on Israel, they understand that such a move will unify Israeli ranks in their favour. Material and even life sacrifices are nothing for them in comparison with their mystical task of fetching their Messiah (which they believe depends on their settlement efforts). They are alarmed however by my gentler surgical approach. They know what works!

Note their tactics, Oz, they keep talking about and turning the focus on the Arabs: Arabs, Arabs, and more Arabs, what Arabs do, what Arabs say, what Arabs think. This is how they win over group C, the security-minded, they never miss such an opportunity. They turn the heads away from the fact that the occupation is primarily an internal Israeli matter, that it corrupts and corrodes Israeli society from within, that as a result there will soon, if the trend continues, be no moral reason or justification left for Israel to exist.

Since I want Israel to exist, and prosper, I call for steps to help Israel cut off and relieve itself of that cancerous growth, namely the occupied territories and settlers.
Posted by Yuyutsu, Monday, 14 March 2011 9:41:48 AM
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