*My point is it still doesn't matter;*

You are free to believe that Hazza, but the evidence shows that
you are wrong. Religion is a powerful force in some peoples
lives, especially religious fanatics.

*Or else why would they single out America in 911?*

Because America is seen as the Capital of the evil West.
Islamists were bombing US embassies in Africa back in the
90s. At the time, America was hardly aggressive. In fact
Clinton was on the verge of reaching a peace agreement
with Arafat. It was close as a whisker.

But violent Islamism emerged out of the Muslim Brotherhood,
of whom Qutb was a member. Violent Islamism is a relatively
recent phenomena. See it like Christians forming a new
Christian cult, out of the old church. It goes on all the
time. One of the reasons why violent Islamism has spread
as it has, is of course the internet. Anyone can now read up
on the ideology and go and martyr themselves if they wish.

Take 1.2 billion Muslims and a small % will be total fanatics,
drawn to that kind of thing. That is enough to create a major
problem in our open and free societies.

So even if you pull out of Afghanistan tomorrow, your problem
of violent and radical Islamism, is not going to go away,
as you imagine

I seem to recall that those bombings in Africa in the nineties coincided exactly with a particularly sensitive juncture during the wash-up of the Clinton/Lewinsky Affair....it struck me as quite coincidental at the time.

Wrong Yabby:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_history_of_the_United_States#Cold_War_.281945.E2.80.931991.29
Start from there and scroll down:
Also, the USA is closely allied to, and sole supporter of Israel (a hated occupier in the Middle East), and also closely aligned to the Saudi Royal Family (Bin Laden's personal top enemy).
Bin Laden himself explicitly stated that the US involvement in Lebannon, its alliance with Israel, and presence in the Middle East motivated his attacks. He did tack on a lot about Islam, but never actually added it as a motive (in his second statement, pointing out that if that were his motive, he would have just as easily attacked Sweden). The transcripts are openly available for you to read yourself.

Also
I never said fundamentalism will go away if we leave. In fact, I'm saying it's not going to go away at all if we stay either. However, it most definitely will become more unstable, and more specifically, more inclined to organize attacks against us, if we remain in the Middle East. Also, there will be less reason for it to spread if it can prove itself able to survive in Afghanistan. And personally, I'd rather it congregated in Afghanistan than be inclined to a diaspora if they lose their grip on the place.

Really Yabby, you had almost ten years of internet access to check these things.

Wrong Hazza, I have been debating this stuff on the internet for
15 years now. I first hooked up in 1995. That included debates with
militant Islamists, who hang out on the Gaurdian UK network.
Their intentions are quite clear, they are global.

So what are you suggesting now? That all Jews leave Israel?

I have read enough of Bin Laden's speeches to know what motivates
him. I also understand the religious ideology that drives him,
which you have never seemingly bothered with so far.

OSW and Yabby I agree every word.
KH we have found common ground of late but not even close here.
Our enemy fights us here in our own country not yet killing here but trying to.
Israel an invader.
Well extraordinary thing to say and wrong.
We must not talk of events in our courts happening now, but it would take just an hour to give evidence no one could say is untrue wars are being fought here.
With lies unbalanced claims and wants.
A cultural war is underway.
I favor the Mossad style of fighting, not trying to bail out the Sydney Harbor with a tea spoon.

As the US Empire winds down and it cannot afford to finance military
expeditions to remote corners of the world, the whole conflict will
change.
Likewise even the Islamic terrorists will be affected by the slowdown
in the world economy. The problem in the west will be the now resident
Islamists who will call it an act of Allah.
They will claim the right to impose Sahria law and fix up all our
economic woes.

That will be the time when we will be most at risk from the fifth
column of Islamists in our midst.

We probably have no more than about 10 years to confront that situation.