Der gee Mahther, that’s say s it all. What a wonderful contribution this debate! Just a repeat of what you’ve said before, with absolutely nothing new!!

You really are shaping up to be the lowest quality respondent that I’ve encountered in my three and a half years on this forum.

Why did you bother with this last post, or any of your responses to me? If you are completely disinterested in debating the subject of the thread and only interested in being strongly offensive, then I will invite you F off right away from this forum forthwith. Do yourself a favour and read the forum rules old boy.

I thought about asking you a couple of questions to try and steer you back on to the debate at hand, but I think I’d be wasting my time.

Thanks OUG for your thoughtful response. Appreciated.

Yes Whistler, it seems that the belief in god and all the terrible future-destroying stuff that goes with it is hardwired in our brains, and that only a very small portion of us can override it and practice commonsense atheism.

Is God Black?

LOL!

Dear Master,

Judaism has no doctrinal objection to conversion, and some Jews want gentiles to convert. However, that is not a majority attitude.

Christianity enjoins Christians to spread the Gospel. Judaism contains no such injunction. Christianity holds that only through Jesus Christ is a person 'saved'. Judaism holds that it is only necessary to lead a righteous life.

You brought up the actions of the state of Israel. Israel is not Judaism. Jews outside of and within Israel have many differences with the state. Some orthodox Jews such as the Satmar completely oppose the state since they believe that only God should return the Jews to Israel. In Israel itself there are many groups of Jews with many different attitudes. One problem is that the Christian Zionists in the United States have backed the most reactionary political elements in Israel. Google Christian Zionists.

I prefer democratic nations that make no distinctions among its citizens on the basis of ethnicity or religion. I favour separation of religion and state and oppose government subsidies for religious schools in both Australia and Israel.

Judas Maccabeus conquered the Idumaeans around 163 BC. They were again subdued by John Hyrcanus (c. 125 BC), who forced them to observe Jewish rites and laws. The Hasmonean official Antipater the Idumaean was the progenitor of the Herodian Dynasty that ruled Judea after the Roman conquest. Herod was a horrible tyrant. He is mentioned in the New Testament as an oppressive ruler and is considered such by both Christians and Jews. Herod’s legacy affected Jewish attitudes since he descended from people forcibly converted. Not only would Jews no longer do that, but also they would require prospective converts to make the approaches. This is tradition not doctrine.

Another reason for the Jewish attitude was the death penalty in many parts of medieval Europe for Christians who converted to Judaism.

My synagogue has classes for people who want to convert, but they must approach us.

Rainer,

I didn't realise he took vacations.

I reckon he was missing for most of the last century, or possibly thought "Oh Damn" and went back to the drawing board.

Ludwig,
You stated; "only a very small portion of us can override it and practice commonsense atheism".

Could you please outline what is "common sense atheism".

What is emerging from this discussion for which I thank you all, is that almost everyone is unaware of how Christianity is woven firmly into the very fabric of our society, and how this benefits everyone, from the many and varied belief systems who post here, as well as the Christians who make up a claimed 65% of the population.

All of the criticism of Christianity leveled at it, have occurred because of the conflict between the Roman Catholic Church on the Continent of Europe, and the English catholic Church, which called itself the Church of England. I do not know how land tittles work in Europe, but in England and Australia all land is owned by Almighty God, Her Majesty Elizabeth the Second is the Trustee of that land, and She grants it on the sale by a State to an individual as Land in fee simple.

As part of that Christian Principle, to protect the individual against the State and separate Church and State from 1290 and the Statute called Qaia Emptores, in force in New South Wales to this day, as S 36 and 37 of the Imperial Acts Application Act 1969. It is so important I will repeat it, because it affects every property owner in Australia.

36 Alienation of fee simple
Land held of the Crown in fee simple may be assured in fee simple without licence and without fine and the person taking under the assurance shall hold the land of the Crown in the same manner as the land was held before the assurance took effect.
12 Charles II c 24-The Tenures Abolition Act 1660 -s 4.

37 Tenure
All tenures created by the Crown by way of the alienation of an estate in fee simple in land after the commencement of this Act shall be taken to be in free and common socage without any incident of tenure for the benefit of the Crown.

These two sections give a freehold landowner jurisdiction over his own land, because socage meant the right to plow and harvest the fruits of the soil. TBContinued.