One Under God: Just wanted you to know that I appreciated your posts -your insights and compassion.

I've seen peeps write that your posts are hard to understand; I don't find them hard to read and I enjoy a novel style. Don't change :)

Antonios:

You were saying that players/men/whomever can't be expected to work out whether a groupie is emotionally or psychologcaly damaged before they bonk her, and you referred to mental health professionals having a hard time diagnosing PTSD. That's true; trauma work is a somewhat specialized area amongst the MH professions. However, the finer points of diagnosis are not what is being proposed; they don't need to differentiate between PTSD and personality disorder. However, th possibility should make them VERY wary. I don't see why they can't b expected to be more discerning about the people they choose to bonk.

Maybe developing a relationship with a woman before agreeing to sex would be one path they could choose; as a way of getting to know whether the person is stable and as a way of protecting themselves against unwarranted charges. (I am not referring to Claire's case; but to casual sex generally and especially group sex).

The transcript states that, "One player told police that at least one of them had climbed in through the bathroom window and crawled commando-style along the floor of the room."

It was one of the players who told police that someone climbed through a window, not Claire.

I mention this because she has been claimed to be a liar by a media story stating that someone who claimed to work at the establishment said it wouldn't be possible to climb in a window. I wonder how many of the current interviewees have been paid for their 2 cents?

Also, "The manager of the hotel in Christchurch, Clare’s boss Keith Burgess, said that Clare was “a stable person” and “the last person to be involved in that kind of thing.” Clare says she doesn’t know the owner of the hotel who has recently made derogatory remarks about her."

Matthew Johns said that the worst possible outcome of the story would be for people to go after the girl.

Now put your stones down.

Ah there you go Pychme, four posts in a row, you got it all off
your chest and should feel better now.

Sadly I don't think you have yet read what has been posted so
far on this thread, but never mind.

*Therefore the activity is socially undesirable.*

People get killed skydiving, rock climbing and skiing. Do we call
them socially undesirable sports?

Clare is in fact receiving weekly payments for her trauma, did you
read the link that I posted? She has an ulterior motive in all this.

But your posts have revealed something else to me, ie why these
problems occur in the first place. You think that blokes should
see the world through your eyes and think like a girl thinks.
You can't understand that they don't. Now let me tell you that
the flight or fight response of a rugby player is quite different
to yours and he probably assumes that you see the world as he
sees the world. For that kind of bloke, yes means yes and no means
no. A crowd of mates is not uneven power, but friends. His perception
of the world is quite different to your perception. That is
the core of it really.

Bob Ellis made a valid point tonight on Q&A. If girls are seemingly
not yet ready at 19 to be responsible for their own actions, perhaps
they should change the age of consent.

The reason that some of us have continued to debate this topic
is because we are sick of OLO girls club going on about women
the victims. What about women being responsible for their actions?

Group sex, exists, but we are told in the last few posts it should not?
Even told police should crack down on it, no wonder I roll on the floor laughing.
Lets ask why? it seems the informant was a well know great footballer and nice bloke,a total Christian.
Our posters thinking the act was dirty surely use Christian standards to come to that conclusion?
Is that the Christian moral basis that let Catholic churchmen and nuns rape both sexs in their care?
And do not forget the church of my birth church of England.
We know do we not? church,s preach one thing and practice another.
Consensual sex, willing sex is none of our business.
The showing of news clips about this is of no use if the clips that tell of other sex acts like the toilet with other footballers is left out.
Or the word of Clare is taken but not several of her workmates, sorry but its clearly a witch hunt.
It ,group sex takes place every day ,if it was in mid day on the Sydney harbor bridge ,20 men one unkown female the headlines would be a one day event.
Sex? let my christian freinds who are without sin throw the first stone.
At my age I have no time to intrude into others sex lives.

Belly:"Group sex, exists, but we are told in the last few posts it should not?"

The New Wowsers don't much like the idea of sex even in the missionary position with the lights out and the door locked, let alone when several people are involved.

Pynchme, well done you! A veritable explosive regurgitation of the Party line and not a single independent thought expressed. A new peak!

Pynchme
I do not condemn the woman for the sex! It was her choice and she is adult and she have full right to do what she did. I understand and support her!
It is not first not the last time that men or women after the sex feel bad or have huge problems.
I understand the women and her desire to leave her alone.
I am afraid that the big publicity has created problems to the girl.
If we did not blame the group sex as something terible wrong the situation for all persons could be many times better.
All this publicity all this rubish about the group sex created a huge press on the girl.
PERSONALY I BELIEVE THAT PRIVATE ISSUES AS THE SEX, WHEN THERE IS NOTHING ILEGAL, SHOULD NOT ALLOWED TO PUBLISH.
You write "However, th possibility should make them VERY wary"
Do you mean NO SEX before we have a cerficate from a specialist that the other side, man or woman has no problem?
Do you mean no sex if we do not know a person for long time?
It is like you try to tell us to follow catholic church or muslims about the sex.
I did not tell that I like this kind of sex but I SUPPORT PEOPLE'S RIGHT TO DO THE SEX THEY WANT IF THEY ARE ADULTS, ACCORDING TO THE LAW.
Pynchme, we have here a personal problem, of cause the group sex but we could not allow ourself to damage BASIC RIGHTS ON THE SEX of cause this problem.
I unterstand the problem, I feel sorry for the girl BUT we can not blame the men for a problem which was difficult to recocnize AND most important NOT TO LIMITE OR VIOLATE THE SEX RIGHTS, BASIC HUMAN RIGHTS, OF CAUSE THIS PROBLEM.
As you can understand MY main interests are for the SEX rights.
If you are not a religious extremist, then be carefull because this personal problem could damage the SEX rights.
Please try to understand what I say and why I say it.
Antonios Symeonakis
Adelaid