Dear Bronwyn,

I don't know if I'm right. But hope is
what's kept me going all these years.
Hope, and perseverance.

I grew up in the western suburbs of Sydney.
Attended public schools, and won a
scholarship to uni. Life certainly wasn't
easy. However, my parents were the ones
who pushed me towards a tertiary education,
with the firm belief that education was my
way in, to a better life in this country.

Anyway, I won't bore you with all the trials
and tribulations of my past history, suffice
to say that thanks to my family's love and support,
I was taught
to believe in my capabilities to aim higher.

If this sort of support does not come from
the home to a child, the only other place that
it could come from is their teachers. And teachers
can inspire students to want to attend school,
and strive for something higher than what their parents
had.

I don't believe in innovations based on belief in
the magic of quantity (more money, more teachers,
more services). These I don't think will live up
to their promises.

What children need and what only teachers can provide
is quality of instruction and equality of dignity.
To enhance the quality of life in the classroom.

Haim Ginott, in his book, "Teacher and Child,"
described his favourite teacher:

"Mr Jacobs won our hearts, because he treated us as
though we were already what we could only hope to
become. Through his eyes we saw ourselves as capable
and decent and destined for greatness. He gave
direction to our longings and left us with the
conviction that our fate can be forged by our hopes
and deeds; that our lives need not be shaped by
accident; that our happiness does not depend upon
happenstance. My Jacobs introduced us to ourselves.
We learned who we were and what we wanted to be.
No longer strangers to ourselves, we felt at home
in the world."

A good teacher can cut the strings
which draw tight the shutters
of a child's mind.

At this time I truly should hide in a corner, without doubt expressing my views will make enemy's.
It always does, every time I talk about the truly poor and under privileged I am branded red neck.
But it gets me mad, people who have never been hungry, never felt ashamed to bring a friend home to a shack called home, telling me I know nothing of the poor.
I grew up in such a world, 16 kids, 8 grew up, one wage, the tread of landlords feet on our drive way bought terror.
A new home no one knew how we would find it, yet we all went to school, some to high school.
Laws had value then if you did not go? welfare man on the doorstep.
except the eldest, it was fashion early exemption to work, feed the siblings.
Our parents daily near hourly reminded us education and work as the way out, it was.
Why do so many confer sainthood on every one who gets Social Security?
My often quoted we don't eat much family I know got $7.000 hand outs, get carers payments for people who look after themselves, run a car repair and re sale business tax free on SS.
Kids need better than this, we must look for better out comes from SS and we must DEMAND SS is linked to both school attendance and real education.
Rudd is no dud, he is so much better than what we had but accountability is not a dirty word.
Lets make every one accountable for every cent of SS we hand out.
Lets stop thinking of the poor as incapable of helping them selves.

OK, my next shocking news in this thread is that the first time I saw the word bogan was when I was doing a contract for Newcastle [Shortland?] Electricity I picked up a brochure at front counter and it said "Don't be a Bogan" and was about the latest "green electricity" fad of the time in 1990.

what is more, put in one more letter and it is my initial plus surname, so I considered this "weasel word?" to be quite racist, sexist and discriminatory [going forward towards closure at the end of the day].

but getting back to what I am seeing this thread developing into, ie haves vs haves not, THAT is not what Bogans are about. For example the lousy army. The 45 out of 50 who you [and perhaps me] would call Bogan were the IN crowd, ie army is RULED by Bogans [eg GW Bush as leader of USA forces] so if anyone felt sorry for anyone it they for us [as Buffy St Marie sang in Universal Soldier].

But to return to who [bogan or cafe latte] I would like to have by my side not only in a war but also concerning any ethical/financial matter, I would go for the bogan any time

Romany, I must disagree that Bogans are simply poor people. Many of the bogans I've encountered, were known as 'CUBs' or 'Cashed up Bogans' as has been mentioned by other people in the thread.

They were people who have come from a certain cultural background, generally lower on the socioeconomic ladder, but they may have attained wealth, or they may be the progeny of those who have attained wealth. They usually do not possess what would be regarded by most as politeness or restraint.
They were typically loud people without consideration for the reactions of others, and usually lacked awareness of how other people viewed them. Their taste in products is also often derided as favouring flashy things without concern for aesthetics.

I've met many poor Australians who could not be regarded as bogans.

Though one could argue that aesthetics are eye in the eye of the beholder. Often, the term bogan is also used by the arrogant to belittle those of lesser means or education.

It's not simple to pin down, but the few universal traits of bogans were ignorance of the things that are usually regarded as high culture, a preference for pop culture that is manufactured for the lowest common denominator, and usually a loud manner of speaking.

Those are about the only universal applications I can think of. The stereotyped bogan, as mentioned earlier, likes powerful cars, beer and rum.

Belly – you are a person whose integrity I respect so please don’t go hide in a corner. We have need of you.

I am certainly conferring sainthood on no-one. You’re entirely right, and I could add anecdotes of my own to back you up. But what gets up my nose is that this underclass is only visible when it’s being denounced.

Each time a Centrelink cheat is uncovered it makes flurries of publicity; inspires pages of outraged people to write in to newspapers; pollies to spout forth thundering denunciations; and attracts smug citizens like flies to a rubbish bin.

The equivalent numbers of people caught out milking their firms, misappropriating funds, or otherwise cooking the books and deceiving people about the same sums of money don’t bring a similar outcry. People tut-tut and purse their lips but they don’t hold forth down the pub about all the low-life scum infesting the ordinary business place. The sums involved are somehow not regarded as terribly serious in white collar crime.

The thing is that these people don’t have a voice. I mean the way you, as a union man, speak for the working person. Yeah, okay, few of them would be able too open their mouths either coherently or without using offensive language. That’s part of the problem.

People talk about them. Who listens to them?

They only get attention when a) they’ve attracted bad publicity or b) elections are coming up or c) someones done a study or prepared a report.

All of the foregoing is done with no actual input from the persons concerned. Sheesh, mate, you know this.

The significance of the presence within our society (they are part of society, however much people marginalize them) of second and third (hell, I know a couple of families where it’s fourth) generation unemployed seems only to strike detractors of the welfare system to prove their point about the misuse of taxpayers money.

To me, however it’s Huge. And needs Huge solutions. Better education alone isn’t going to do. It needs solutions from everyone from citizens to politicians to educators

TRTL – (Apologies, everyone, that my two posts got printed together.)

Yes, you’re right, I’m not being clear. Damn! I’ve written and presented so much material on this that my brain is running ahead and I know I’m not using my 350 words wisely. Plus its one of those things I have been described as being “passionate” about.

I appreciate that not all bogans are poor. But a bogan with money is a bogan no less

Whatever they may become the tragedy is that, like the Beverly Hillbillies, such persons are incapable of assimilation into the wider community. That was part of the hopelessness I mentioned earlier. I’ve known so many kids who desperately hated who they were – which is pitiable in itself - but felt that no matter what they did they couldn’t become other than what they had been born into.

Look, until a few years ago I didn’t even know that such people existed. I had no pre-conceived ideas because such a culture was hitherto undreamed of to me. I was completely at a loss when I found myself plonked down in the middle of it with two impressionable kids. So my own entry into this world was through kids/teenagers.

Which is why I, in turn, have to disagree that bogans lack perception of how others view them. They know perfectly well but they are powerless – peer-pressure; braggadocio; defiance; education; lack of knowledge – to change. Then I got to meet the parents (often, initially, as a mediator between the kid and the parents) and discovered they are just the same. Then I got involved in their lives and started to discover why.

Of course not all poor people are bogans. Poverty per se does not effect ones basic being. Living without hope does though.

I still maintain that this problem is far more huge and complicated than we own and that it’s going to take more than a change in the education policy to do anything about it. We’re on the cusp of the gang culture here and soon it’ll be too late