Nicky
With all due respect I dont know how you get a private biz from a doc from =
SUBMISSION TO THE SENATE COMMITTEE FOR RURAL AND REGIONAL AFFAIRS AND TRANSPORT
ANIMAL WELFARE BILL, 2003 PRIVATE MEMBERS BILL
SUBMISSION FROM (AFIC) AUSTRALIAN FEDERATION Of ISLAMIC COUNCIL AND COUNCILS IN CONJUNCTION WITH (HKM) HALAL KIND MEATS, PALE AND RSPCA QLD

The whole point is and Andrew well knew there was a proposal to work united to STOP long haulage full stop.

HKM is a MOU where by the above parties have united to adress animal welfare.

To work with the industry of meats and not against them opposing people eating meat is the only way to improve the industry and there for animal welfare.
In return for assistance yes a small percentage is to be donated back to Animal Welfare.
100% of that is to go towards improvements and fund sensible animal welfare groups.


Surley people know by now so call self imposed codes of practise are not enforced.

Your all aware RSPCA have less than one hundred inspectors Australia wide to do dometic and farm

No wonder things havent changed in years.

The next thing that must be adressed is all this waist of time and money setting up these so called invitations to public to comment on animal welfare.

I repeat the public will neither follow all the codes or have the time.
Why on earth this farse has not be protested I dont know.

Andrew sat at a table by our invatation quite some time prior.
So he knew what this was about and that its the only answer to finding an alternative tolive exports and long haulage.

I am just wondering why people could not see a vote for them was simply a vote for ALP

PALE, that is basically how the document itself describes it. It is quite clear that, to put it crudely, money is intended to change hands.

It's also a fairly self-serving document, seemingly written with a view to coercing everyone with an interest in animal welfare to be part of this/these organization/s (the "my way or no way" approach again). Was it at that time that Andrew Bartlett withdrew his support? You said in earlier posts that Animals Australia had prevented him from having anything to do with you at all.

I've gotta say also that it contains several expressions (as well as spelling, puctuating and formatting) that I find it very hard to believe were written by "Muslim leaders" or anyone of the Islamic faith ("chooks" is one example).

Cheers
Nicky

pale, are you joking, I've never said they aren't able to buy our chilled meats. My point is that if we ban live eports on the basis of how the animals are treated at the other end this can only be interpreted as religious intolerence. ie they slaughter their sheep the way they do because of religion.
Having been affronted on religious grounds by the Australian people, will they then be eager to buy our chilled meats?

I don't know if we can get them to pre-stun their animals over there, but if it is acceptable to muslims here it should be there and we should be able to point that out. At the very least we can show them how to effect slaughter with minimal stress to the animal(without blinding and tendon cutting). Advice that would be worth less without our presence.

It's a difficult concept, I know.

Nicky, propaganda doesn't have to be false, it's how you present and spin. It's how you envoke emotion for a particular cause, and just to be sure throw in a few children for good measure. You don't suppose that photo was published to further a cause do you?

Aussie bull was it?

You don't have to dignify my comments with a reponse. I'll just read between the lines.

dickie, once again you're barking up the wrong tree. I have no such connections, cruel or otherwise.

I propose the exact opposite of dictating to another country- work alongside, not demand.

By whom is Aust deemed a cruel nation? the japanese whaling lobby, those who don't understand the reasoning behind mulesing?

I should hope all religions would have animal welfare in mind, it should make it all the easier to talk with them about archaic methods. Perhaps it's time another prophet came along with an update

Nicky Said

I find it hard ..
pale replies.

Well Nicky I cant see why. If you click here you will see these people along with the RSPCA QLD CEO and three of our lawyers.

Mind you watch out for that awful music that is the bushmens bible you always complain about.

http://www.halakindmeats.com/
Andrew is of course a libber himself and while i respect that perhaps its part of why we didnt get too far in parliment.

Mind you like I said a vote for them was a vote for ALP - Say Hey - you figure it out.

In Andrews defense he gave some good talks up in Rocki.
I think its pretty clear to us all that your real agenda on olo is to bag our people.

For two years you have trailed and flamed our organisation.

That is a matter of record which hasnt gone unnoticed.


Your anti farmer and anti muslim rants throughout this forum are also a matter of record and are quite typical as to how this problem has been handled for many years.

pale has a different approach. Thats our business.

Rojo
What utter rubbish. Perhaps you should read other things than just the mla and industry reports...
pale replies
Here we are again - A media release from Muslim Leaders-
http://www.livexports.com/afic.html
Now Rojo once again that quite clearly statedmuslims DO NOT require animals alive for religious purposes and they go on to ask the government and industry and the media to be HONEST when reporting on live exports.
" Of course that was a tall order"

It is a fact Muslims readily accept pre stun chilled meat.
Live exports only continues because the industry donate heavily to political parties to keep their vile trade going
A indusrty that exports our raw material in its most vaulable form - before value adding. A industry that benefits just a few and is reasonsible for the death of the regional areas. A indystry with the suffering of millions of animals on its hands that could have been slaughted here saving the long haulage.

I keep reading this thread but get more and more confused about what it is actually about.

1. Crutching:- Would not this be a kindness to sheep avoiding and reducing fly strike? -which is VERY nasty.

2. Live exports:- I know there have been arguably a few problems with this in the past. Hasn't this been addressed with more veterinary oversight and care? I am not convinced there is no market/demand for live exports-otherwise why go to the trouble and expense?

3. Avoiding "long hall" of any farm animal in Australia is impossible due to the geography of the country. If there are concerns about this perhaps inspections and some more oversight by Primary industries might be appropriate. I have never head it raised as a problem before.

4. The slaughter of all animals (including humans !)needs to be looked at again. This is happening already with more humane killing systems being trailed in the USA.

5 Factory farming treats an animal as a commodity. But I am happy to buy pork at $5. a kilo, and and a chicken for $3-4. When I was a kid Chicken was Christmas fare only.
Perhaps meat can be labelled as eggs are "Factory farmed" or "free range".Then let the consumer/market decide.
I would have thought the vast amount of anti-biotics used by the industry would be more of a concern.

6. We kill six million kangaroos a year in Australia. They are hardly endangered. In fact they are better for the ecosystem/soil/environment than hoved animals. They should be marketed more widely.
The RSPCA has raised concerns about treatment of joies. If Australians were allowed to keep native animals as pets, it would be easy to find them a home. I am a bit puzzled why female Kangaroos are shot at all.

7. While vegetarianism might be a nice idea, teaching kids how to identify,grow,cook and eat them in schools would be a better strategy than ill-informed rants from Croatia on how Australia farms its meat.