"Your bleeding heart quotation has nothing to do with the Middle East"

Islam has nothing to do with the Middle East Dickie?

This is the huge difference between us. You focus on the problem,
I focus on the solution! All my life I've had people like you
around, saying we can't do this and we can't do that. I then
went ahead and did it anyhow, leaving them shaking their heads.

If you want to change anything in the Middle East Dickie, forget
shaking your arrogant Western finger at them, forget your high
and mighty approach. The one thing that matters in the Middle
East is religion and if you use that wisely, then you are
on a surefire winner!

I remind you that there is quite a large Muslim population in
India and this guy clearly knows one hell of a lot more about
Islam then you and your veggie brigade do. And he is saying
exactly what I have been saying: You will get results if
you highlight religion in this debate, something that people
like you are just ignoring.

I can't help your limited thinking Dickie. Fortunately I've
never taken much notice of people like you, who can't think
much beyond the tip of their nose.

"Europe still refuses to accept Australian lamb and mutton of
any volume in their market, unlike the New Zealanders. So Australia
has no choice but to ship to the third world"

Yabby - In general, the mutton that you speak of is merino isnt it? Cull animals, past their best production years? Not the best eating.

Wouldnt it be true to say that only third world countries would want them? That maybe live exports need the ME to unload these lines of sheep?

My understanding is that New Zealand export prime lamb and have such acceptance in Europe because of the high quality of their product.

Yabby said to Dickie

You focus on the problem,
I focus on the solution! I then
went ahead and did it anyhow, leaving them shaking their heads.
Pale Comments.
Dickie
While we are all giving Peter McGauran and ALP heaps- and rightfully so isnt it fair to say Yabbys comment holds some water?

I have already explained on the other thread how the Democrates got their first enquiry into Animal Welfare- And! many votes for themselves and labour preferences at elections.

Cant you see that no matter how "well intended" this has been a political joke for years?

Somebody has been using somebody else OR perhaps both lots were involved.
STOP this Animal Welfare concern coming only from the veggie point of view and come up with some alternatives.
Set up Free Range Farms with educational programes working with REAL FARMERS in some sort of franchise arrangment. Real farmers hold the key! Only THEY have the skills to teach humae practises.

Until the majority of representation to both our Governments comes from main stream meating eating farmer supporting members of the public NOTHING will change.

Until the Animal Welfare Groups ALL combine and ALL work WITH THE FARMERS to reopen plants and get them FAIR Prices- nothing will change.

Yabby is the ONLY one Dickie whether you like it or not who has EVER done anything towards finding an alternative. Thats a fact.
I know you wont like me saying this- but its true.Unless hes telling me porkies I think you will find he did spent quite some time trying to assist in reopening plants in WA.
Thats doing something to try to solve the problem Dickie- Thats positive.
Dickie - What is it you really want?
Do you want to see Animals Slaughtered here in Australia where there are some codes of practice[ Not Enough] Or do you want to educate people not to kill animals or eat meat?

To be fair to all readers of this forum and Midas McGauran I think that deserves an answer?

"My understanding is that New Zealand export prime lamb and have such acceptance in Europe because of the high quality of their product."

PF, NZ exports to Europe, as they have sheep that eat grass rather
then expensive European farming systems, plus a massive 260'000 tonne
quota to send both mutton and lamb to Europe. Much mutton is
further processed, into things like pies, sausage rolls, even
pork flavoured sausages!

Australia has a 16'000 tonne quota, despite the fact that we have
twice as many sheep. All processors that I know, could easily
increase exports to Europe and there is demand there for product,
if Australia's quota was increased. Fletcher will confirm that,
he's tried hard to get the quota raised, but failed.

West Australia in particular depends on exports, as we don't have
the domestic population as you do, in the East.

The Middle East trade was based on merino wethers for years, but
as merino wethers are becoming scarcer and scarcer, all sorts of
animals and carcasses are going there, including plenty of prime
crossbred lambs.

Fact is, if I sell a 16kg carcass lamb locally, that carcass will
land up in the ME, I will be paid 1.50 a kg. Thats prime lamb,
not merino. The NZ farmer will get 4.50 a kg for his 16 kg carcass,
which goes to Europe mainly. If that lamb goes on a boat, it will
be worth around $3.75 a kg.

Pale is correct, I spent alot of time trying to get some sense into
the local processing industry, to establish more processing facilities
here. There is no labour, various applications are bogged down in
EPA problems that take years to resolve, the WA Minister of Ag
is not interested. I put it to his offsider to have the Govt appoint
a facilitator to resolve these hurdles, nobody wants to know.
Ok fine, well then we'll just steam ahead and improve welfare in
the Middle East, I think that could be easier achieved then many
think, landing up as a win-win for Middle East animals too.

"you want to change anything in the Middle East Dickie, forget
shaking your arrogant Western finger at them, forget your high
and mighty approach. The one thing that matters in the Middle
East is religion and if you use that wisely, then you are
on a surefire winner!"

I do believe your alter ego, Manuel, has again emerged, Yabby. Pray tell, Manuel, how have you managed to point your arrogant Western finger at the Islamic religion to tell them how to suck eggs?

Your only agenda is to enhance your perfidious profits with the pretence that you have halted animal cruelty in the Middle East - all hail Caesar!

"Everywhere we turn, our faith is both subtly and overtly belittled, and we are continually pressured to adopt western ways, to assimilate to the so called "more civilized culture".

"The same goes with western "Christian" countries that somehow feel they can malign the Muslim world for sacrificing animals, when they themselves have institutionalized factory farming and worldwide environmental destruction."

."The Western powers do what is wrong, knowing it to be wrong and having no qualms about it, thinking that they will explain it away with their method of double-talk." (Shahid Ali Muttaqi)

And our resident imperialist, Manuel believes he has sufficient supremacy over an ancient ideology to subjugate them to do his bidding.

Those with an IQ beyond 2 digits know that any Westernised abattoirs in the Middle East are simply a ploy to increase imports of live animals.

Ah...yes, Manuel is dealing with an ancient culture who are smiling quietly and viewing Manuel with contempt.

But you go for it, Manuel, but I implore you, please take your hand off it!

“Those with an IQ beyond 2 digits know that any Westernised abattoirs in the Middle East are simply a
ploy to increase imports of live animals”

Ah, so there we have it. Dickie’s conspiracy theory! Now scratch your butt for
a minute to get your brain working, and start asking yourself some serious
questions.

With oil at 100$ per barrel and billions of $ pouring into the Gulf, you really
think that the Arabs need ploys. Money is no object in the Midde East. There
are no restrictions on buying livestock from Europe, Africa, South America,
Asia. Yet you think they will invent these devious schemes, which they don’t
need in the first place, as part of your conspiracy theory. Dickie, you really
need a cup of tea and a hot towel on your head, to calm the demons in there :)

“Your only agenda is to enhance your perfidious profits”

Dickie, if I was about profits, I would not be in farming, but in banking,
insurance, or managing your super fund. Farming is by far the least profitable
of any industry sector, but people like me are involved, as we love the lifestyle
and we enjoy working with nature, animals, etc. Some of us do also have a sense
of justice and believe that farmers should receive a fair price for their products,
not just huge megabucks for you city slickers in your offices.

I remind you that despite your quoting of odd individuals with their opinions,
Islam and its prophet made it very clear that Muslims should be kind to animals.

You might want to ignore this fact to suit your veggie agenda, but what
Muhammed said matters in the Middle East, ignore that reality at your peril.