"Just remember you raised Landmark. "

Err hang on Pale. You keep raising AWB, of which Landmark is
simply a division. AWB is of course a non issue in this
debate, so its you who is going off topic.

I've made some points about a practical solution to the
whole live sheep story, based on reasoned thought, which
anyone is free to comment about.

As these points are outside of the narrow little ideology
of the veggie brigade, no doubt they will not even
be considered.

So we'll just muddle along as we are now, with no satisfactory
outcomes and nothing changing

Wendy the only one off topic here is you.

Go back and read dickies opening post.

"The gut wrenching, ABC report showed footage of hog-tied animals, shoved in car boots. Others crammed into trucks, exhausted and distressed. Live animals being dragged backwards by one leg to have their throats cut."

Hello! all this happens here in australia. So what happens if you manage to stop them being loaded on ships? Doesnt matter? You think your work will be done? You need to think about the consequences of your actions and follow a plan through.

Your narrow little view point and uninformed arguements and made even worse by the personal attacks you launch every time some ones opinion differs to yours.

If you want a private conversation with Dickie, pick up the phone, otherwise we are free to post what we think.

dickie
You may email us if you wish. As you know this is what happens every time somebody such as yourself or us and others open a thread on this topic.
We have said ONLY when abattoirs are reopended in Australia will there be less road transport here and no ships taking our Australia Animals off to third world countries.
Personally I find it distressing that others refuse to assist to open plants back here in Australia.
Thats the Answer- Its the ONLY answer and it always will be.
I was happy to post about AVA Landmark MLA and others however its impossible with the serial trouble maker.
I also find your support of the live animal trade discusting PF especially while using good people such as verna to promote you web pages.
Every group you have been in contact with has suffered PF because of your trouble making.
RSPCA also are very busy people who are so short staffed are unable! to through away their time.

Good thread Dickie and of course we support it.
Live Exports is our Nations greatest shame along with Intensive Farming.
Open Free Range Farms and reopen abattoirs if you want to fix it.
I know Dickie you cant do this alone.
Nor can we- However we are more than happy to assist with contacts and lawyers.
We wont be posting here anymore on Animal Welfare until GY does something about this women flaming every ! Animal Welfare thread.
We have other things to do.

Yabby
AWB is not a `no issue`. They are live exporters . Its so sick that the public dont seem to care that they say they can not go further with the AWB evidence because they ran out of funds.
You know all these bloddy hot shots - big time Animal welfare groups didnt even KNOW AWB were live exporters!
Whats my point?
My point is with their HUGE donations taken from the public they havent even bothered to do their homework.
Why is that important? Because if you dont know all the facts about something how can you possibly fix it?
When I first contacted AA and AL they simply would not believe us AWB were live exporters.

FIRST they requested we prove it.! For God Sake. So I did that but there still NO reply.

Yesterday I received a call from Dickie. Thanks so much Dickie. Dickie didnt want to be seen posting against our work to reopen plants in Australia.- Lovely Person.
Thats Ok Dickie. You can say it. As a matter of fact I wish they would all say it publicly instead of blacklisting our organisation and calling us animal killers.

Yabby Said
As these points are outside of the narrow little ideology
of the veggie brigade, no doubt they will not even
be considered.

So we'll just muddle along as we are now, with no satisfactory
outcomes and nothing changing.

pale replies
Yup- At least you got that much right Yabby= Only thing is I do not think I will waste much more time on it myself.
They want to STOP live Exports but they REFUSE to assist to reopen plants.
Nothing has changed.
Seem to be a money making racket to me that uses good people to run their rallies etc.
We love Animals enough to make SURE they are at least slaughtered here.
We will most likely withdraw after six years of their blind refusal to see it the way it is.
Regarding the veggie B - I totally agree with you Yabby.

"Hello! all this happens here in australia. So what happens if you manage to stop them being loaded on ships? Doesnt matter?" says PF

Your acknowledgement of the cruelty to animals in Australian abattoirs is noted, PF. However, for you to use this as good reason to continue exporting live animals reveals some type of twisted rationale or extreme ignorance on how animals are processed in the ME.

Prior to departing from National Forum, I am compelled to make mention of the lack of concern by other posters who clearly could not care less about the welfare of animals.

Only Pale and I have attempted to inform readers on this thread, about the methodical torture perpetrated on animals by the false prophets of greed. We have been, at all times, forced to endure the nasal monotones of the resident gnome who has a polemic against all other species.

I am conscious also of the many religious posters on this forum who have contributed zilch to any article which may have assisted in bringing about change to the lives of factory farmed animals.

These are the posters infiltrating most threads to convert the non-believers, demanding they prostrate themselves before their God, asking for forgiveness for their acts of impurity.

These are the ones who constantly hold polemics against those women who must choose abortion (God, there's already 6 billion 700 million of us), whilst gluttonising over Big Macs.

These are the ones who moralise over gay people whilst covertly influencing parliamentary illuminatis with glib tongues and money boxes, fully aware that political malfeasance does not happen in the absence of criminals!

Christians and others who stand for nothing .....enjoy your Christmas roasts, your cracklings, your pate de foi gras...for you profit nothing from your vain pretence.

"reveals some type of twisted rationale or extreme ignorance on how animals are processed in the ME."

You miss the point completely Dickie, but then I am not surprised.

At some point you and others are going to have to accept, that
reality does not go away, when you close your eyes and wish it
would. People are not going to all become vegetarians. People
will overwhelmingly continue to eat meat and to farm livestock.

Sometimes in life we have to compromise, accept that our personal
agenda is not going to happen, other options need examining. This
is clearly not going to happen in this industry, because of
the extreme blinkers that some posters wear as to reality.

Fact is, the live trade is not going to end tomorrow, with
farmers burying all their livestock in burial pits. Fact is,
many have put forward proposals to slaughter extra stock in
WA. They have been bogged down in labour issues, environmental
issues, etc. Thats just to slaughter the animals already around,
with the assistance of the live trade, which absorbs 3-4 million
animals.

I've put forward a realistic suggestion. If the Middle East is
your problem, and WA has no labour and taxes exporters to the
point where it all becomes unviable, why not open a major works
in Malaysia ? Its far closer then trucking sheep to NSW or
Victoria. On a modern boat, animals have space, food, water,
shelter. No different to feedlots, which exist all over Australia.

Humane handling and slaughter could happen, taking away your
Middle East fears. It would be a win-win for livestock, farmers,
meat buyers.

Would you or Pale consider it? Clearly not, by your response.
Your blinkers are on.

PF, being not only a person who cares for animals, but also
somebody who can think outside the square, accepted my point
that a trip to Malaysia on a boat would be far kinder then
a trip on a truck to NSW.

Its common sense, but common sense is severely lacking in
the animal libber debate