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The Forum > General Discussion > The fallacy of a 2 state solution for Palestine.

The fallacy of a 2 state solution for Palestine.

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The United States is demanding AUSTRALIA and others take tens of thousands of UKRAINIAN REFUGEES. these people are mostly Ukrainian Jews, which it is feared will be killed by the Russians when they overrun the whole of Ukraine.
Posted by Paul1405, Saturday, 24 February 2024 1:39:54 PM
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"AC, you do not get it. Understand what 'From the river to the sea Palestine shall be free.' It means the eradication of the State of Israel. Do you support that cause?"

Point 1.
For starters, both sides say it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/From_the_river_to_the_sea
The phrase has also been used by Israeli politicians. The 1977 election manifesto of the right-wing Israeli Likud party said: "Between the sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty." Similar wording, such as referring to the area "west of the Jordan river", has also been used more recently by other Israeli politicians, including Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu on 18 January 2024. Some countries have considered criminalizing use of the phrase.

Point 2.
Do you think I don't know what the 2 blue stripes on the Israeli flag represent?
- Pretty much the same thing, so no offense I may not know everything but I'm not a complete fool.

But that's not the question you asked.
You asked if I supported that cause?

On some kind of moral level I do.
The Palestinians were promised self determination to rise up against the Ottomans, that's what they should've been given.
Not 80 years of 'extermination-lite'

But that's not realistic, and I support negotiations, dialogue and compromise over conflict.
Innocent peoples lives are just as important as lines on a map.

For this reason I DO support a 2 state solution as some kind of compromise or end to the conflict.
And after what Israels been doing I'm not sure Israel deserves it's own state, but the alternative is more innocent dead.

You all know I can be stubborn and harsh, and I've said before that if Israels right to exist means endless subjugation, persecution, oppression, execution, genocide etc, - all I've seen in these last few months and more, and all for land theft - then I don't support Israels right to exist.

I don't support an endless continuation of all this killing of innocent people.
Do you get that?
Posted by Armchair Critic, Saturday, 24 February 2024 2:18:45 PM
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Go look at the land changes in 48.
Thieves should never become owners.
But this is 100+ years of displacement, since the first boat loads of Israeli immigrants started coming in 1918.
80+ years since the founding of Israel, by terrorism.
All these years of hostilities.

I just want people to be able to live in peace and with dignity.
Have families, build a home and have a happy life.
Posted by Armchair Critic, Saturday, 24 February 2024 2:27:20 PM
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"The United States is demanding AUSTRALIA and others take tens of thousands of UKRAINIAN REFUGEES."

I haven't seen any such request. Evidence please.

Not that I'm opposed mind you. Ukrainian refugees would be far preferable to the MENA refugees we've been taking recently. Jewish refugees even more so.

".... Russians when they overrun the whole of Ukraine."

Even if the Russians do break the will to resist of the Ukrainian forces, they won't overrun the whole nation. They have neither the will nor the capacity to do so. But more importantly, the Poles would take the opportunity of the collapse of Ukraine to occupy west Ukraine which they already claim should be theirs anyway. Remember that places like Lviv have been part of various Polish states for most of its history including the inter-war Poland of 1921-1939.
Posted by mhaze, Saturday, 24 February 2024 2:45:54 PM
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"since the first boat loads of Israeli immigrants started coming in 1918."

We've been over this before but just to reiterate, European Jews started arriving in the Levant long before 1918. Indeed there's always been some Jewish presence there.

Larger Jewish immigration to the region began in in the mid-19th century encouraged by the Ottomans who saw that the Jews could make the land prosperous and therefore profitable to the Ottomans where the Arabs had failed. Equally the Arabs were happy to sell what they thought of as useless land to the Jewish immigrants. So from c1850 to 1890 the Jewish population grew from a few percent of the total to around 10% and by 1914 they made up close on 15% of the region's demographics. All before the British got involved.
Posted by mhaze, Saturday, 24 February 2024 2:59:08 PM
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Fuhrer Netanyahu has said there will be no two state solution, just the final solution! According to the Zionist there will be no Palatine, just Greater Israel populated by Israelis and the few former Palestinians that survive, they will be an Arab servant underclass, serving the Jews.
Posted by Paul1405, Saturday, 24 February 2024 4:20:01 PM
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