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The Forum > General Discussion > What is the Origin of the Palestinian People?

What is the Origin of the Palestinian People?

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Benjamin Netanyahu has made it quite clear in
many of his speeches that Israel is - "Not a state
for all its citizens," in reference to the country's
Arab population.

He said that "Israel is the nation state of the Jewish
people - and only it."

Netanyahu leads what is seen as the most right-wing government
in Israel's history.

In June 2009, United States President Barack Obama said:

"Israel must acknowledge that just as Israel's right to
exist cannot be denied, neither can Palestine's."

The question of Israel's legal right to exist has been and
is one of the most emotively charged questions in the
vocabulary of international law and politics.

It also brings out the exterminationist rhetoric of
numerous Arab and Islamic politicians and ideologues.

And it is something that has gone on for decades and looks
like it's not about to end anytime soon.

A tragedy that should have been resolved decades ago -
but is still ongoing.

The history of the region speaks for itself and it
won't be ending any time soon until a cease fire is
implemented.
Posted by Foxy, Tuesday, 31 October 2023 9:59:22 AM
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Hi Foxy,
A lot of things you have been lead to believe in regards to the war in Ukraine were a complete lie, and many of these facts came out as the war dragged on, but weren't well publicised and you only find out these facts if you're really paying attention, and the media had done it's job in convincing you of the lies initially, and it's hard to go back after the media spin spread the lies and see the real facts.

For example.
(I'm not going to dig up references, but you can find them if you dig)

Jens Stoltenberg head of NATO admitted that prior to the Russian invasion, Russia send a letter to the US and NATO, demanding they stop any further plans for Ukraine to join NATO.
Russia saw the expansion of the US empire up to it's border as a legitimate threat, and had been voicing it's opposition since 2008.
The West refused to agree to this, which left Putin no choice but to invade, for the purposes of de-nazification and de-militarisation.
- It was not unprovoked, but there was never any plan to go to Europe and all those countries knew it.

Do you think they would all give up their own weapons and leave themselves defenseless if they actually though Russia was coming to conquer them?

Prior to this Putin tried to gain 'autonomy' for the people of the Donbass, the West agreed to the Minsk agreements (guaranteed by France Germany and the Ukraine signed and ratified in the UN) but secretly did not, they were buying time to arm up for a fight.
This is confirmed by Hollande, Merkel and Poroshenko.
Posted by Armchair Critic, Tuesday, 31 October 2023 10:14:09 AM
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[Cont.]
Russia did not send a force in to 'take Kiev'.
This was meant to show Ukraine it was serious and force them to the negotiation table, which it did - and initial terms had already been agreed upon and signed (To which Russia withdrew from Kiev as a show of goodwill) but on 1st April, 5 weeks after the invasion, Boris Johnson, (at the behest of the US) flew to Kiev - convinced Zelensky to tear up that initial agreement, told him the West had his back and would support him for 'as long as it takes'.

Next, there was no great Ukrainian counteroffensive, anywhere.
Russians strategically withdrew from the right bank of the Dnieper in Kherson, and they also withdrew in Kharkov region.
Ukrainians mere took up the positions Russia had abandoned.
It was a successful withdraw in Kherson, but messy in Kharkiv.

If Zelensky had agreed to Russias demands in regards to NATO, the war would've been over after a month, Ukraine may have even gotten part of its territory back under the deal, and there wouldn't be any 1.5 million dead and maimed.

These are just some of the facts that you misunderstand, by lies by the west and in the media.
I know as a person with Lithuanian heritage you are deadly petrified of the Soviets because of the history, but what you think is true is not what happened.

You were deliberately played, in order to gain yours (and others like you) support and complicity in justification for and a continuing of the war.
Posted by Armchair Critic, Tuesday, 31 October 2023 10:17:53 AM
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[Cont.]
The cause of the war in Ukraine was the expansion of NATO up to Russias borders.
Put another way, the cause of the war in Ukraine was an expansion of the US empire up to Russia's borders,
- and the potential Russian loss of it's Black Sea naval base at Sevestopol, and the potential for nuclear weapons stationed 600 kilometers from Moscow.

Russia was defending itself against these actions, and wanted a new collective security framework for eastern Europe, he most certainly was not trying to conquer Europe, and all the European countries knew that but instead fear, misinformation and disinformation.

- The exact thing you complain about with Peter Dutton and the voice referendum.
YOU WERE HAD by the same type of lies and mistruths you yourself claim to oppose.
Posted by Armchair Critic, Tuesday, 31 October 2023 10:27:49 AM
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Armchair Critic,

My information sources are different to yours.
Mine come from people actually living in the
regions who can relate the facts as to what
really happened - despite the Putin propaganda
and attempts of the justification of his actions.

We've been through these arguments many times in
the past. There's no point in continuing to argue.
Posted by Foxy, Tuesday, 31 October 2023 10:49:32 AM
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Same old AC. He falls for every piece of propaganda from Russia and convinces himself its true. One has to be particularly gullible to think that the original drive on Kiev was anything other than an attempt to knock Ukraine out of the war before they had a chance to react or that the defeat of the Russian column was anything other than a debacle for Moscow.

If the aim of the war was to keep NATO away from Russia's borders then that aim is already defeated. NATO is now 30 minutes drive from St Petersburg. So, if that was the war aim, its already over in which case Russia may as well seek peace on the basis of status quo ante bellum. They don't because that wasn't the main war aim. The main war aim was to reabsorb Ukraine into the motherland, preparatory to seeking to re-unite other lost territories.
Posted by mhaze, Tuesday, 31 October 2023 2:51:49 PM
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