Even the UN only 'considers' that Israel occupies Palestinian territory. So, when it is an historical fact that land is 'disputed', saying it is 'occupied' is ignorant denial, to put it mildly.

Now, I don't claim to know (or care) about every hectare of land in the area, but I do know that Israel left Gaza in 2005.

The conflict is unpleasant enough, without ignorant bigots shouting from the sidelines.

To answer to mhazes argument the simplest way I can...

'People lived there!'
- This is the point I'm trying to make.

When my Great Grandfather was there in 1917, he wasn't running around exterminating every man woman and child.
People lived there, and after the Ottomans lost, people still lived there.

To argue that these people didn't chop some wood, build a town hall, elect a chairman, had the ladies serving tea and scones, pass a motion for a founding document, decide to build a parliamentary building with elected representatives, decide an agreed name for their new country and seek international recognition....

Doesn't change the fact that people lived there, and had done for generations.

Your argument that they hadn't done those things seems to argue, "ah well, I guess we can just slaughter these vermin and claim the whole place as our own it'll all be mickey mouse and bona fide."

Australia has in part had to come to terms with it's own horrible history, but Israel is still doing it, no different then if we (as a comparison) were still running around killing indigenous people.

What Hamas did a few days ago to 'so called' innocent Israelis, (and I say so-called - because they knew what their government has been doing, and at minimum are indirectly complicit in it.

What Hamas did was no different to what Israel did to them in the Nakba.

And I'll tell you how full of shite the world is...

Vladimir Putin has been charged with war crimes for removing kids in a war zone for their own safety.
What then should Netanyahu and the entire government of Israel be charged with in Nuremberg-like trials when they have willfully killed more kids in a week than the amount of kids that have lost their lives in Ukraine during the entire Russia / Ukraine war?

I say Netanyahu and the entire complicit Israeli government should all face an international court for war crimes.
If any Israeli minister or public servant didn't support their own governments actions then they should've stepped down immediately.

Dear Critic,

«And it's not even important what I believe, what is important is what adherents of those religions themselves believe.»

Then you should state so before providing such links. Otherwise it is understood that Sheikh Imran also represents your personal views.

As far as I can deduce from that video (because I have never seen that fellow before), Sheikh Imran is just an attention-seeking dirty old man, and is anything but religious. As you now say that his views are not yours, I wonder why at all you had to introduce us to that idiot.

«I've stated many times before that I'm more about ethics than religion, as a foundation for a moral compass and knowing right from wrong.»

Ethics, a moral compass and knowing right from wrong are a foundation of religion. Without them, claims of being "religious" are just hollow words.

«I think all of the so-called 3 Abrahamic religions are flawed in their own way, and none of them are a true path to happiness or enlightenment.»

And I doubt why they are called "religions" in the first place - perhaps because despite all their flaws, there are still some individuals who manage to spit out their toxic/inedible shells and incorporate the inner sweetness of these three into their personal religion.

«In case you didn't get it, that pretty much makes me some kind of sinner by the tenets of each of those religions.»

We all are sinners so long as we are not yet united with God.
Your stated preferences do not make you any more sinner than myself and the rest of us.

«Isn't the real truth of the Jewish Orthodox version that they aim not to rule over just the Jews, but to rule over all of mankind?»

The accepted position of mainstream Judaism is:
"The only difference between this world and the messianic era is subjugation of the exiles to other kingdoms, from which the Jewish people will be released. However, in other respects, the world will remain as it is" - http://www.sefaria.org/Shabbat.63a.10?lang=en

[continued...]

[...continued]

«Why would I support a future that forces me to become a product of a religious ideology that makes one race privileged above all others?»

Just drop the word "religious" and then your statement makes perfect sense. Some hypocrites enjoy and benefit from describing themselves as "religious" and their claims as "God-given": if you don't like them to benefit from such lies, then don't believe them!

---

Dear Foxy,

«Just to let you know - there are many Palestinians
who do not support the murderous rampages of Hamas.
They do not support the wholesale slaughter of
civilians any more than any of us would.»

Very true. Some of these Arabs were also murdered in Hamas' despicable attack, some were hit by rockets from Gaza and some of them are loyal Israel citizens who now serve in the Israeli army and fight Hamas.

«And the
same goes for Jews who do not support the actions
of their Zionist government.»

And the same also goes for Jewish Zionists who do not support the actions of Netanyahu's present government.

Zionism is simply about the need for Jews to live in Israel, that's all,
not about treating others badly,
not about acquiring and occupying more land.
Some historical branches of Zionism did not even require a Jewish state.

I haven't read all the comments but thanks to Armchair Critic and ttbn.

Some thoughts-

The Hebrews are part of the 13 tribes of the Bible at some level they are the same people- perhaps they are really on the same side in a sense. Middle Eastern people have been invading Europe for thousands of years- remember the Persians.

Often the Hebrews are on the side of the Democrats- almost sounds like false flag- but they call the cash register The Jewish Piano. There are many famous Hebrew Communists including Marx, Trotsky, Marcuse, etc. Hebrews seem to play both sides against the middle in politics.

Both the Hebrew's and the Palestinian's are not Anglo's- and so in a sense are not part of Anglo-Australian's sovereign interest- but I suppose in the context of world stability there is an arm's length interest.

Broad Euro-Christian culture is derived partially from Judeic culture although in an adapted form (also heavily influenced by Roman culture)- so perhaps some believe that our interest lies in solidarity with Hebrews- but perhaps objectively it should be on an arms length basis.

The communist one world culture view perhaps puts them in opposition to Hebrew cultural preservation in Israel.

Just some thoughts.

"Ethics, a moral compass and knowing right from wrong are a foundation of religion. Without them, claims of being 'religious' are just hollow words."

Well you may think that, but I'll give you a realistic example of why I think that is untrue.

Let's start with the harm principle

The harm principle says people should be free to act however they wish unless their actions cause harm to somebody else.
- I say 'everybody has a right to live however they choose so long as it doesn't have a negative or detrimental effect (harm) on others.
- I also say that 'everybody has a a right of stand up for themselves when harmed by others' which means that if you harm others, you should expect criticism not be taken aback by it when it happens.

Religious people put religious doctrine into the space (in the human psyche) originally reserved for ethics, but they don't know the first thing about ethics, because they ascribe 'God's will' to that which is 'Man's will' whom was given 'Freewill'.

Let me give an example, during Covid I saw Jew, Christians, Muslims all still congregating despite the fact that doing so might spread the contagion to others. What did they all say. 'Jesus is the cure', 'God will protect me', 'If I catch COVID then that's God'd will'.

They did not give a shite if they were to spread covid to other people and that caused harm, they simply wrote off what they were doing (congregating in the middle of a pandemic) i.e. 'Man's will' (as an extension of 'Freewill') as 'God's will'.

They even complained, tried to defend their positions, and continued to do it, when other people (who may have been harmed by this practice through the spread of COVID and who criticised it - and had every right to)

They knew it was wrong, knew it had the potential to harm others, and continued to do it anyway.

So there's an example for you where I can say that religious people by and large do not know the first thing about ethics.