I think Donnie has given god the death blow. When I was a child it was rare for my siblings and myself to recieve chocolates. Unlike today chocolates were not everywhere. Chocolate that was avaliable was relatively expensive. Toothapaste was not as advanced as it is today and wisdom of my parents was to ration chocolate as a special treat. The simple chocolate easter egg pulled sway. Therefore to me chocolate is still imbued or fetishised with meaning it does not in true physicality possess.

Kids today have access to chocolate at will and for that in my forgetful moments appears as decadence. "In the good old days" we knew better. During the enlightenment as life deconstructed was becoming more complex those in less technologically obsessed socieites suddenly became nobel savages. 'Civilised' man became the convoluted sin destined for destruction.

During the Industrial revolution the country side became romanticised, cities were pure expressions of the survival of the fittest, the city dweller crude and violent. The country life was the simple life thus blessed except for most of those who actually lived there.

The argument that gods way is the utopian way is nothing more than mere romanticism spouted by people swept along with no control over their lives. Life has never been more gentle than in the 21st century for those societies which have embraced science and technology. A single metroplitan clinic helps more ill in one single day than the alleged Christ ever did in his entire life time.

BURIAL TOMB OF JESUS

Often in these threads, I have posited need to Christians adopt a "forensic" approach to theocrasia [the architecture of god building], the authoriship of the scriptures, an the spin/re-interpretations of the Church(es) by church leaders.

Now, I am in the same position as a typical Christian: Herein, my council is to [tentatively] maintain the tomb is "not" the burial place of the historical Jesus. There are vagaries, self-interest and ambiguities involved. It would inappropiate to draw firm conclusions. A "forsenic" approach is needed.

So, Sells, I do practise what I preach:

It is essential that wild claims are not made in situations unsupported by the firm, triangulated evidence, in every case. Not just "belief".

The tomb must be thoroughly examined through the lense of histographies and social constructions [common names], just as claims to Jesus's divinity must be viewed the the lense of histographies and social constructions [common theocrasia from the Axial Period to 500 CE). With the Tomb, we must not have unproven claims, made after the fact, just taking names and pasting these on other historical events.

We must not have researchers making "a priori" assumptions and just moving on from there based on a belief that the tomb "is" the tomb of the historical. Such an "a priori" assumption is irrational. Is it not? Else, it could lead to all sorts of false, untested beliefs. And can't have that; can we?

Oliver in essence Christians remain better off with Jesus missing. The tomb of Christ exists only in the hearts of christians. The real Christ existed in ink on well worked hides and has probably long been consumed by beatles. Jesus if ever a man is long dead and if his tomb exists and by chance he is was the jesus found a few decades ago then its ironic that Christendom deny him.

A further irony is it is sad that all that had occured in the name of that poor pile of organically rich dust and calcium chips Christ when found is denied as the god as he has been claimed by Christians. If the tomb is indeed that of Christ then the biggest blasphemy ever commited toward Christ is the Christian denial of his corpse which will always remain silent in almost all of the universe.
Meanwhile the second coming as it turns out was finding the grave of the poor sod and it could never in reality have been anything grander. Even if the tomb is not that of the real Christ it is in many ways a lesson in how a few thousand years can blow out a delusion of grandeur.

Does Jesus still live ?

Well Mickey Mouse became more important and more loved than Walt Disney. We will never find Mickey Mouses tomb either.

West, you have used my name in vain yet i am not the god assassin of which you speak ;)

The 'God' way may not be the utopian way, as you say, but surely our culture of the West is not the idealised Christian society perhaps envisioned by this big noted "thug" Athanasius when he *laid down the law* on the Trinity disunity way back when.

"Life has never been more gentle than in the 21st century for those societies which have embraced science and technology"
Not to detract from what "science and technology" has endowed us, but it has yet to lead to solutions of the type that Christ was attempting to instill, to improve the relations and decencies of man.

"A single metroplitan clinic helps more ill in one single day than the alleged Christ ever did in his entire life time"
Perhaps in the treatment of ills, but will said clinic inspire the hearts and minds of men for the next 2 millenia?

DOUBLE STANDARDS? WE WILL SEE.

West, as usual, I appreciate you post. Thanks.

Sells and his colleagues recognise the "mythology" in Roman mystery cults and other religions. But wont recognise the same constructs pertaining the architecture of the Christian religion. We are meant "in the first instance" to accept an "a priori" posit, without researching foundations. Understanding is said to flow from "belief" and forensic research is suspended.

Now, what of a person, whom maintains by "faith alone" that the bones are those of Jesus, and, adds, we will ignore complementary descenting commentary by historians and scientists, casting doubt on the religuous nature of God's bones. What of a person, who irrationally and "a priori" maintains to understand that the bones are really God's, and, ambiguities/alternatives are the the work of Satan?

Most importantly, the Bones of Jesus must be the Bones of Jesus, because a TV documentary makes this claim: The scripts the narrators use written Testaments given Holy Sanction by the producer.In this way, Jesus of the Bones, is a matter of faith and belief, alone, which is outside scholarship. In Letters and Epistles to theatre chains and marketing agencies, this Truth is made very clear. Especially, after a Synod of writers parsed many drafts.

For adherents of Jesus of the Bones; the mystery Celts of Mythras and Jesus of Resurrection are just mystery cultures. Only, Jesus of the Bones is real and exempt from scientic method. Lastly,[Like Constantine] Black Beard was a convert to Jesus of the Bones, having won battles, after flying the skull and cross bones... this must be proof.

Oliver, most of these infected and poisoned unfortunates become so well immunized in the process that they just do not play outside their playpen. They have been repeatedly warned, are well armed with entrenched avoidance behaviours like pulling down the shutters, disconnecting and walking away from highly plausible arguments. This kind of belief doesn't require evidence because it is issued as pure rote "learning" and boyo does it have all bases covered. e.g. The great disconnect where belief in something without evidence is elevated as a particular virtue because there is this notion that any fool can believe something based on evidence. BUT, belief without any evidence takes "real character". lol

The only self-evident fact of nature here is that this whole teddy milieu is a contrived and twisted unreason coupled with very powerful inducements on captive and vulnerable minds. It is a closed control system where the end product of this process is simply one of damaged goods rather than the true achievement of human potential. There is no thought of reason, humility, free inquiry, dignity, participatory democracy, in this systematic manipulation for this is the world of the unreasonable.

Probably harder to understand for the teddy infected types is that this delusional attachment that supposedly takes "real character" is one of the major causes of crime in every shape and form.