So much to address and so little resources. And it doesn't just apply on this forum either.

OK. To the first question by Keith on Police staffing levels in the town that I worked in. I can't fully answer your question as I'm not privy to the formula (and there is one) that determines staffing levels. But I can tell you that we often needed everyone of them. Firstly the town is some 200Km from the next town, which happens to also be a 24 hr station, so of course any arrests that resulted in bail being refused, which is quite common with repeated domestic violence offenders and/or breaches of AVOs, then they had to be taken there. We worked 8 hours shifts there, so basically if we got an arrest as above, processed the person, conveyed them to the 24 hr station and returned, we had done our 8 hr shift. So while we were tied up if anything else happened, additional Police had to be called out. I think you can see that it wouldn't take long to utilise all of the 11, two of which were supervisors, quite quickly.

Also not all 11 were available at the one time, you have training, court, sick, leave, officers transferring in and out etc, so realistically you never had more than about 7 available at one time.

Sometimes we needed all 7 because of brawls that would occur from time to time. 7 Police is not many when you could be facing 100 or so less than friendly people. It was the case that we often called for more, but were turned down. I think you get the idea anyway.

So I suppose it based on a combination of remoteness and workload.

As for the Hurley situation. Again I don't know all the details, but I've read what you have all said. I suppose you have to understand the legal system, what the Coroner suggests is based on all the available evidence as he is not governed by the same rules of evidence as criminal courts. The logic being that the Coroner should be able to get the to the truth of a matter no matter what.

Then the same evidence put before him, minus the evidence that would not be allowed into a criminal matter, is reviewed by the DPP and it is on this evidence alone that they must decide whether or not there is a good likelihood that a criminal charge would be proved.

I have seen instances where in the Coroners court what happened and who is to blame were very clear, however when looking at the brief that was left after taking into account the rules of evidence, the matter was not so clear. Maybe this is one of those matters, I just don't know.

If he is guilty and it can be proved, then by all means charge him. As you point out, Police are not above the law, but neither should Police be treated differently to everyone else under the law. Maybe this is one of those cases where the bady gets away? I know it's not good, but it happens, a lot.

I think it has been said, but Police have more watch dogs than any other profession in history. Do you know that the DPP have a special section devoted to 'just' prosecuting Police and no one else, and believe me, they do not do us any favours. I know this from first hand experience.

I think what I find difficult is the over simplification of a very complex, difficult and emotive subject. I don't know the whole picture and I think it safe to say that no one on this forum does either. So lets not jump to ill informed conclusions.

Quiggley,

Here is the link to the coroners report, it may help us all make informed decision. Having read it several times it opened my eyes to a degree of reality in this case.

http://www.justice.qld.gov.au/courts/coroner/findings/mulrunji270906.pdf

My frustration is aimed at the Governments because of the aftermath. The death was tragic but consider that in the two years since the death in custody, the Doomadgee family has been left with no explanation and support to cope with this horrific incident. Subsequently, his Mother passed away not knowing what happened to her son and Mulrunji's son committed suicide.

Secondly, once the Tactical Response moved in, many children have been traumatised with masked Officers raiding homes at will. What justice and sense of normality will they have? What will they think of Police for the next 40 years of their lives.

The Government over reacted in the response to the burning down of the police station and under-reacted at every other incident in this case.

Of course this is emotional but when you witness to different treatment handed out by police you can't help but hope for justice to occur, for us...at least once. I personally have been harassed by people whenever I have been confronted by them. The only positive interaction I have had has been with those Indigenous ones in the force, I know of 5 young guys and one female. Yet I continue to see different degrees of service. For example, in one night I witnessed (at 5pm) a police officer picking up a homeless Aboriginal man and throw him in the back of a police sedan, he then kicked the man 4 times as the man was unconscious. About six hours later at a service station, I saw two officers help a huge (at least 100kg) passed out white guy into their car and drive him home, all the while saying, "we'll look after you big guy."

Sadly, I agree with you Quiggley, I think Hurley will get off and I await this outcome and the response from the Indigenous community.

What do you want society to do? While packing up and leaving would be what Jesus would likely do, it isn't going to happen.

I don't think politicians just blame Aboriginals, the problem is so large, it seems so hard to deal with.

I grew up in a poor area, and had older brothers who were best mates with an Aboriginal guy. He didn't have any of the anger that many have, but still ended up in prison after doing stupid things. His family were decent people, his parents didn't drink, but the communal nature of Aboriginies meant there were always dozens of relatives living in the house, bad influences on him from older uncles.

There are so many things that can be done though to fix the problem, with politics, scare campaigns about stolen generations getting in the way.

Surely the lives of children in such situations should be paramount? Who says one loses their culture if they become like us?

What is Aboriginal culture anyway? Isn't it allowed to change over time, adapt, like European culture does?

The Jews have done it successfully, to live in modernisation, yet remain true to who they are.

I think there is too much anger among Aboriginal leaders, and let's be honest, racism. Many Aboriginals hate all white people, as if we are to blame for their nation being taken.

In one way, it's better it was us and not some closer culture that don't acknowledge their indigenous people. Most don't even know that Japan has indigenous people!

Aboriginals have so much opportunity now, more than any of us, it's just that the family situation needs to change. But this can't happen unless the kids are taken.

As sad as it is, what is needed is a whole generation of kids to be brought up in stable homes, whether by white or Aboriginal parents, so they can lead stable lives.

G'day to Keith & AKA...
I've read with interest the import of AKA, and the fact that you've been married to an ex-copper for 27 years...you have my profound commiserations, AKA ! Just joking of course. And Keith, you sound bitter and resentful toward police per se ? ..."if I were in trouble, or when I was in trouble, a copper was the last person I'd wish to see"...! I'm sorry you feel that way. I guess there'd be nothing I could say or do, to alter your perception of police.

In answer to someone's comment/question, apropos the events of 'Palm Island'...If the 'Sergeant of Police' has committed a crime, he should be charged. And if convicted, appropriately punished. Conversely, any Koorie that has committed an offence, he/she should also be charged, and upon conviction, appropriately punished as well.

A further comment/question was also put. In relation to the apparent delay of the commencment of any action, that had been recommended by the coroner...I'd have to simply re-affirm what 'Quiggley' stated; and his explanation of the processess of the DPP. I'd have absolutely no idea why the Sergeant in question, has not yet been dealt with. Particularly if the coroner is of the view that the Sergeant does have a case to answer.

However, I repeat what 'Quiggley' said inter alia, NOBODY is above the law. Believe me, coppers are monitored very closely. Even to the extent that some even have to declare and furnish their private financial position. And during most Internal Investigations, the police member is COMPELLED to answer questions. There are many other conditions (peculiar to), that are only imposed upon the police. And, none of which are imposed upon the general public. One more 'little' thing, a copper can't simply resign when he/she feels like it, either. They can be held for (depending on the State) up to three (3) months duration, and longer if internal (disciplinary/criminal) proceedings are pending.

Kind regards...O Sung Wu.

O Sung Wu

It is so sad you couldn't accept the humour in my statement.

You're right though, your partial quote of me does confirm you and, if you are representative, police do have narrowly focused outlooks.


Have you ever received a speeding Ticket?