PART B (due to word limit)

. if we had an alternative to Liberal that was not inclined to kiss bush's ass im sure it would have been voted in by now. Labour is not a alternative to anything, there hardly worth calling a party these days.

3. “yeah, but of late most terrorists were Muslims" - as per my comments above

4. “if you consider Islam a religion (I don’t) then you cannot differentiate between extreme and moderate Muslim. They both adhere to the same ideology but utilise different methods of Jihad."

I wonder how if you would have said this about catholism when the spaniards raped south america in the name of religion? Most muslims i think youll find condem the actions of fundamentalists, as most catholics would condem the actions of many empires throughout history that used religion as a politcal tool to kill of societies (e.g. spain vs south america)

5. As for the Iraqi liberation from the tyranny of a pseudo-muslim dictator – I agree that the perceived motives can vary depending on which side you stand. I am not a bush kisser either.

Its pretty obiovus why bush invaded iraq, i dont think we need to play dumb to justify this inhumane act. it sure in hell wasnt to liberate the country. as for weapons of mass destruction, well that odd, isnt it america who sells these weapons in the first place? why is america allowed to have weapons of mass destruction.

6. "India and Pakistan" ...

i think its more to do with the fact that there is no economic gain to be had if america invade pakistan or india, no oil to be drained, etc, etc, etc. Pakistan is also a key country in the middle east from a strategic milatry point of view. but yes, no money to be made means america no interested, by all means india and pakistan blow each other up!

I do agree though, if they had there bombs pointed at israel then im sure bush would be eating mutton curry for the next 2 years!

Kish--I'm not a moslem and you make an assumptions that isn't based on what I have said.

You sure wasted your vote. You know--the greens and the democrats were anti the war in Iraq, you could have voted for them. I guess stopping the war just wasn't that important to you.

The Uk, America and Australia have invaded a Moslem country hadn't you heard? Most Australians were against the war? Nonsense. The majority voted for Howard knowing he was pro the war continuing--that's how a democracy works you vote for the party you think is doing the right thing. They thought either the war was the right thing or that it was not important enough to register a protest against. Labour--they originally came out against the war and had a policy that if they got into power they would withdraw the troops from Iraq, but they withdrew the policy because the polls were showing it didn't have public support. The people spoke. In a dictatorship maybe the people can be blameless for the actions of the government but not in a democracy.

Numbat, I was talking countries and no Iraq did not attack the US--a small bunch of Saudis did. But the US government sure attacked Iraq. I think there is a difference when a whole country goes to war with another and when a small independent band practices terrorism-especially when there was no link between the attacked country (Iraq) and the terrorist band. Does your insistence all Moslems should be held responsible for the actions of some mean you take full responsibility for what any christian has done, now and in the past?

As 82% of Americans are christian you can safely say there is a probability that any Americans involved in torturing, raping and killing of Iraqi civilians are predominantly christians. As for the atrocities happening at all--you do listen to the news don't you?

kish,

I will focus on point “1” for now

Reading the Qur’an and scrutinising it are two different things. Unless you compare it with other scriptures, historical, and cultural accounts, you will fail to spot the deception it so “poetically” represents. If it were at all comprehensible, it wouldn’t have needed other books to interpret it.

Most Muslims don’t understand what they recite and are not encouraged to do so. Most are illiterate and or don’t understand the Arabic language. They must rely on the agreed teaching of their devoted leaders.

Yes, the Qur’an talks about Christian and Jewish stories – but most are distorted, historically inaccurate, non-chronological, unrelated and incomplete. So to say that it shares similar nature or ideology is much uninformed and downrightly dangerous. For starters Allah is not portrayed as the God of the bible.

The violent nature of some Qur’anic verses is intentional, most explicit and central to Islamic teaching. They are not taken out of context like you (and most Islamists) would like us to believe. Jews and Christians are targeted by name.

Your anti-Jew/ anti-American / pro-Palestinian sentiments are not shared by most Australians as you say. Israel has more rights to exist than the Arabs. That and other myths have been the source of conflict since Mohammad declared war on Jews, Christians, and in fact all non-Muslims. (Check reliable historical facts).

I respect your opinion on US terrorism – as I said before I don’t share your sentiments – but I agree that terror is an unacceptable human behaviour even if the motives are perceived as noble and just.

And finally I don’t follow CNN or any biased commercial news

coach

I have read a number of books comparing how islam came into existance as opposed to say christianity and i agree that muhammed there main profet was a war hungry idiot. I also acknowlege that number of the teachings and cultural practises of there supplementary hadith texts are morally wrong in todays society. I dont believe the quran is a source for voilent behaviour however, I believe it is used as a politcal tool like all religions have in the past to promote violent behaviour ("in the name of allah or god, etc").

Israel do not have a right to push palestine out of there own country. You cant say that because 1500 years ago Israelis were prominent in that region therefore they have a right to it today. If thats the case none of us have a right to australia, nor do half the populations have a right to there country of residence.

I don't have an issue with Jews living in that region seeing as they bought half the land of the palos with the help of the US post world war 2. What I do have an issue with is Jews pushing palestinians out of the remaining half of their own country with the tenth most powerful army on the planet. It's seems incredibly hypocritical to me that the Jews who just got slaughtered in world war 2 by hitler now treat poor palestinians in much the same manner as they were treated by the germans.

You can't tell me that what the Jews are doing is fair. naturally the Jew run US woudlnt dare show footage of Jews imnposing war crimes, only palestinians with hammas and other hot headed fundamentalists.

aziliz

you are correct, I did make that assumption on your nick (which sounds rather islamic).

I dont really know which country you have been voting in, but in australia voting for the greens and democrates where you do a one party prefered or a preferential vote will almost always go to labour. Especially in my area where the two big candidates are liberal and labour. The greens and democrates always have preference to labour over liberal, voting for them is the same as voting for labour. you should watch more elections analysis before commenting on "democracy"

I hardly see that as a protest vote, im voting for a party that has the same foreign policy as liberal yet they are much more incompetant in managing the ecomony and seem to have next to no policies in anything accept oposing liberals policies by default. Lets also put there initial oposition of the war on iraq in perspective. they only opposed this because liberal supported it as they do with every policy liberal porpose / support.

Australians do not vote in liberal because of there foreign policy, they have been voting in liberals for the past decade because the economy has never been better. Its a historical fact, that when the economy of a country is good, the party in power rarely gets voted out. People care much less about a war on the other side of the planet then they do about whats happening in there own backyard. To even suggest the majority of australians want this war because they are voting liberal is laughable. i do not know a single australian that likes to have our troops fighting an American war. Especially now that they realise the premise for this war was a fabrication of the bush regime.

I dont know which australians you socialise with but I cant think of a sigle person that i have rasied this issue with in Sydney that is pro bush and pro invasion of iraq. So please don't include my name in this invasion because "democracy" supposedly works.

kish,

>>I dont believe the quran is a source for voilent behaviour however, I believe it is used as a politcal tool like all religions have in the past to promote violent behaviour ("in the name of allah or god, etc").<<

The misconception that the fault lies with only a handful of misguided Muslims who are not adhering to Islamic principles and hence indulge in terrorism for political reason is very common.

Any deluded Non-Muslim who thinks that Islam is the religion of peace and that it is only reckless Muslims who commit terrorism and atrocities, must pick up an English translation of the Qur’an and READ it.

Muslims mass murderers like Zarqawi will attain Paradise, whereas any Non-Muslim (you and I), even if we happen to be a Saints are eternally damned to Hellfire by Allah's decree.

In Allah's own immortal words:
Those who reject faith (Islam) and belie our signs, They shall be Companions of the Fire and abide in it. Q 2:39

Just hear the statements of the unrepentant terrorist Abu Bakr in Indonesia after his release from prison… He is hailed as a hero by all true Muslims.

It is time for the entire world to realise that Islam by its very nature and through its essential principles openly supports, and promotes Terrorism of the worst kind. [I agree that does not excuse Israel for retaliating… but what would you do if your neighbour was violent by decree from his/her god?]

Know one thing : the Islamic terrorist is in fact the most devout Muslim, because he is following EXACTLY what Islam teaches through the “Divine Qur’an” which is considered by Muslims to be the EXACT words of their god Allah dictated to Mohammed (??)

The Qur'an functions as the central terrorist manual that urges them to slaughter, rape, torture, pillage, mutilate and molest all Non-Muslims...(until we all submit to Islam).