I Stopped contributing to this thread, as I thought the arrogance and total dismissal of everyone by KAEP, was just a bit to much. Also being so narrow and arrogant in his perception, showed his fear at not being right, or noticed.

But his statement,“The hand of the Lord moves in very mysterious ways and it is all we can do to play our part.”, shows we can all relax now, he's a christian. So what more can you expect, but aggression, abuse, denial and put downs. Keep it up KAEp, whatever you have to say, will be taken in the attitude that you present it, ugly.

You have things to say that are relevant, but just like your beleifs, they are but a small part of reality and just about everything that has been said in support of global warming, climate change and ecological collapse, are correct. It just depends on the percentage of their contribution. You can be 99% right, but if you fail to recognise the 1%, you can never be right. As they say, a miss is as good as a mile and that goes for all things. Sadly those that are blinded by their beleifs no matter what they are, fail to see all aspects and are always wrong in the end.

It doesn't mater what is causing this, or how you name it, its happening and thats it. Until there is massive change, nothing will alter the decline of our environment, thats contributing to our sociological collapse.

I assumed that MikeM was just trying to lighten up a thread with with a big of humor in his Sunday 12 9:30pm post. I thought it was light & witty.

Afterall the tread has become very laborous & low on spontanaous bouncing around of ideas.

A forum is a space where different ideas are put in & no one is RIGHT or WRONG - particuarly on an issue like this.

Surely we are not investing our homes in our post but submitting a "suggestion" or an idea; without attachment to it.

The Alchemist your post was very interesting & gave me food for thought.

It does seem that those who are Fundamentalist Christans seem to think along the lines of "there is only one truth & everyone else is wrong & I am duty bound to convert everyone to my truth"
This doesnt leave much room for lively discussion.

Alchemy,

You sir are a liar. You stopped posting here because you could not find any links to support the useless opinions you continually sprout. At the rate of two or three a paragraph and not any proof in sight is it any wonder you get bored? I doubt you even bothered to read any of my posts. Like to take a quiz?

Natasha,

You cannot spell. That is my opinion.You are entitled to a different one of course but you would be WRONG. That puts a big hole in your theory about opinions on this forum. Global greenhouse warming, the Kyoto protocol and the IPCC which underwrites them are all dead. I am just waiting for the burial which will come as the US hurricane season approaches. I feel sorry for the US to have to bear what is in store but it will be a real turning point in this debate that will shift it from problem to solution. And that's how it SHOULD be.

BTW there used to be opinions about horses V cars. Guess which opinion failed?

And in the opinion stakes "global warming V thermodynamic instabilities", I have already won. Not because I am clever but because THERMODYNAMICS can't be beaten.

Of course YOU ignore thermodynamics. You put your head in the sand and moan in misspelled glory. But I suggest that this puts you in a rather vulnerable position n'est ce pas?

In The Meantime.

Preliminary bouts for the US Gulf Coast main event:

A swarm of tornadoes killed at least 10 people across the American midwest and damaged so much of Springfield, Illinois' capital, that the mayor said he believed "every square inch" of town suffered the effects.

http://search.smh.com.au/click.ac?u=http%3A%2F%2Fsmh.com.au%2Fnews%2FWORLD%2FTornadoes-rip-across-America-10-die%2F2006%2F03%2F14%2F1142098428989.html&t=4&n=1&s=tornados

My generation cant spell without a spell check & we write in text so much well anyway whatever.
Forums are meant to be a bit of lite fun in my opinion. They are not like being at work. This thread feels like hard work & I do enuf of that on work days.
So anyway whatever. The very issue which is the title of this thread is stifled because ONE SINGLE poster is determined to make his point of view the only point of view.
There are plenty of other forums to discuss this issue anyway.
Farewell The Alchemist & Mike M. I may post to a different thread here l8ter. N

KAEP,

in the opinion stakes race in which you run, you inevitably win. At the same time you inevitably come last. Nobody except you is demented enough to run in that bizarre event.

But what would you say if the SMH report was wrong, and instead of tornadoes, it was a swarm of thermodynamically enabled killer tomatoes that trashed the American midwest and killed 10 people?

Don't give up, Natasha. KAEP's Progogine tomato theory will never stay the distance.

New cross media ownership laws, science and opinion.

Labor's communications spokesman, Stephen Conroy, attacked the newly proposed changes to media laws: "The existing media barons will have greater ownership, greater control over the diversity of opinion in this country. That's not good for DEMOCRACY and that's not good for DIVERSITY OF OPINION"

We have already seen on this forum the blind hatred of alternative ideas to greenhouse warming theory. Of course scientific opinions like the flat earth, horses are better than cars and greenhouse warming are all valid scientific opinions. No one here is denying the right to PRESENT them. Only, if evidence exists to disprove them then that evidence has a place here.

Here is the problem with extended media monopolies: and their ability to restrict and pillory opinions without any scienctific proof whatever: Media barons are prime players in the Global Economy. Greenhouse warming theory is ideal for the global economic model of usnsustainable growth of markets and slavish populations to support them.

Greenhouse warming in particular as a scientifically untenable opinion has these advantages to the global economic model:

* GW has 100 year plus long term solutions (greenhouse gas limits and alternative energy investments) that can be lost, forgotten or subverted. Nothing ever has to be done. I mean, there have been billions of dollars and millions of words supporting alternative energy in the US and yet the cupboard is bare.

* GW has a fear factor that empowers governments to more tightly regulate our lives and build populations beyond sustainability for new markets.

* GW obviates the need to clean up riverine catchments and coastal oceans. An acceptance of the Thermodynamic model of climate change would sound the death knell for the global economy. It would enable individual empowerment and foster social equality.

The message from the ruling elite is clear. Thermodynamics is a bigger threat than terrorism and come hell, high water, tornados, killer tomatoes, droughts or hurricanes it will be supressed.
The oceans and rivers of the world and their ecologies are EXPENDABLE so long as 3%-5%growth-global economic targets continue to be met.