Saltpetre,

From faulty memory, wasn't one of the sex allegations against Trumpf that he demanded that one of his 'partners' have an abortion ? Of course, it's a woman's right to choose - when men can get pregnant, I suspect that many will modify their views. But until then, it's a woman's choice.

Currently, it's the woman who has to bear the child and, usually, raise them for twenty-odd years, while the bloke can piss off and try his luck with another 'partner'. And - like Trumpf - another, and then another. So it's alleged. So many nice pieces of arse, and if you can pay your way , .....

Joe

Yes, Joe, I also believe it has to be the woman's choice - for so many legitimate reasons, which I'm sure has been discussed on previous threads, back in the dim, dark past.
Mind you, I don't like the idea of 'sex selection' as a justification, but that's a cultural thing, so I guess we have to 'live and let live'.

My intent was to see if Josephus could 'review' his trust in Trump on the basis even of the very video clip he referred me to, as well of course per the mountain of evidence demonstrating so clearly that no-one should trust anything that Trump asserts, ever.

Our world is going to hell in a hand-basket, and so many can only concentrate on the shoes they're wearing or their waist-line.

I see on David f's thread how the Ogres and Trolls are emerging from their dugouts to trash any hope for sanity in a world seemingly bent on self-destruction.
Should be interesting.

Take care, Joe, we're in for a bumpy ride.

Dear Joe and Saltpetre,

Few issues in recent years have so divided our
society as has the morality of abortion.
In some countries, like the US, where in New
York State, there are almost as many abortions
as live births. In short, abortion is being used
as a means of after-the-fact birth control.
To some people this is a matter of no particular
significance, for others, it is little short of
mass murder.

The right of a woman to control her own body also
to me has ambiguities. Half the genes in the fetus
were contributed by the father, and although the woman
must bear the child, society may make the father
responsible for the child's support for nearly two
decades thereafter. If the father waives his
responsibilities - for example, by deserting the
mother - then of course he has no further rights in
the matter. But if he accepts his responsibilities and
wants the child born, what are his rights in relation
to the mother's right to control her body?

And for those who believe that the fetus is human, there
is athird party present. The mother is controlling not
only her own body, but somebody else's potential
body and life.

Well, Dear Foxy, you put the case succinctly.

It is indeed a dilemma, and fraught with entanglements.
No easy answers, and a case of conviction.

In another time, it has been revealed that the San Kalahari Bushmen would set aside in the bush any newborn determined by the dominant female of the tribe to be beyond the capacities of the tribe to care for properly - at potential risk of the wellbeing and prospects of the tribe as a whole.
Heartless or survival, and the determined 'greater good'. A dilemma.
(Or, as Spock would put it, "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or of the one".)

How to adjudge the best interests of the woman - the 'bearer', the crucible upon which (or whom) all future ultimately relies and depends - or of the 'other half', the supposed supporter, 'reliable'?

IMHO, the determination of the woman should, and must, take precedence.
All else is surely interference in the woman's life and right to self-determination.

Is one life more important than another?
(Black, White, male, female, yours, mine?)

It is a brave new world, with troubles aplenty.

Dear Saltpetre,

Not surprisingly, opinion polls show public confusion
on the issue of abortion. The great majority of the
population supports abortion in cases of rape, incest,
or a threat to the mother's health. But support for a
mother's right to abortion on demand fluctuates.

In any event, today abortion must be seen in the context
of social changes in premarital, marital, and family life -
particularly sexual permissiveness and the sense of
individualism that leads people to make decisions primarily
in terms of their personal desires rather than of traditional
norms.

A look at the decline in the mental ability of Joe Biden since 2008. Followed by his Policy for 2020.
http://www.facebook.com/officialbenshapiro/videos/215883599833015