Foxy,

"I get the fact that you do not feel any guilt
about the past treatment of our Indigenous people.
That is your choice."

Whether I feel a sense of guilt or not doesn't alter the fact that neither I nor any person my age or younger or older cannot be responsible for something that happened before they were born.

Do you think that a German girl, born tomorrow will in 18 years be responsible for the crimes of the Gestapo?

Dear Is Mise,

The following article explains things much
better than I ever could:

http://www.abc.net.au/religion/articles/2012/04/24/3488313.htm

If you wish to continue to discuss this subject -
start your own thread. I am sure that many people would
be interested in hearing what you have to say on the subject.
I've said all that I have to say on the matter.

<<I can only assume that you are a gay aboriginal refugee.>>

How perceptive of you Shadow, you got it in one. You application of labels is remarkable. You must have a draw full of them, and pull them out at will, very interesting approach. Combined with your crystal ball, a definite winner.
Also interesting is how you apply your value logic, in this case to the Catholic Church in Australia. It goes like this;

Child abusers, a no no, minus 20 points
Educate children, a yes, plus 20 points
Doing charitable works, a bonus, plus 10 points

So at the end of the day we calculate the Catholic Church is a positive 10 point institution and therefore should not be subjected to any criticism in relation to its negative areas of behavior. Very interesting concept, if it was only true.

To say I hate all things Catholic is untrue. Numerous times on the forum I have praised the good work done by the Catholic, Father Chris Riley in Sydney. However there is nothing in the good work of Fr Chris which in anyway can be taken to diminish the child abuse crimes within the church. A good Father Riley does not balance a bad Father Denham.

Shadow, you seem to think very much like Archy Pell. Are you a Cardinal?

Foxy,

A very good article, i am tempted to say brilliant, and I thank you for the reference; but perhaps you will bear with me when i quote from it?

"....if we give up on citizenship and try to hold responsible the actual descendants of those who went along with odious regimes like Hitler's Germany,....trying to hold people directly responsible for the sins of their ancestors: it comes down to "guilt by blood," a principle that we strongly reject in other places. (Just think of the claim that contemporary Jews are responsible for the death of Jesus - a claim that is rightly considered both ridiculous and evil.)"

The author goes on to place things in perspective and talks of 'Honour"; I agree with him on that and that no one alive today (as quoted above) can be held responsible for anything that happened before they were born.

May we presume that as you linked to the article that you agree with both the author and me?

Further to the subject:

"Priests Commit No More Abuse Than Other Males
BY PAT WINGERT 4/7/10 AT 8:00 PM

FILED UNDER: Culture
The Catholic sex-abuse stories emerging every day suggest that Catholics have a much bigger problem with child molestation than other denominations and the general population. Many point to peculiarities of the Catholic Church (its celibacy rules for priests, its insular hierarchy, its exclusion of women) to infer that there's something particularly pernicious about Catholic clerics that predisposes them to these horrific acts....Yet experts say there's simply no data to support the claim at all. No formal comparative study has ever broken down child sexual abuse by denomination, and only the Catholic Church has released detailed data about its own. But based on the surveys and studies conducted by different denominations over the past 30 years, experts who study child abuse say they see little reason to conclude that sexual abuse is mostly a Catholic issue. "We don't see the Catholic Church as a hotbed of this or a place that has a bigger problem than anyone else," said Ernie Allen, president of the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children. "I can tell you without hesitation that we have seen cases in many religious settings, from traveling evangelists to mainstream ministers to rabbis and others."
http://www.newsweek.com/priests-commit-no-more-abuse-other-males-70625

Just thought that I'd throw that into the mix for a better texture even if it doesn't alter the flavour.

Is Mise,

As an apologists for the Catholic child abusers, your 2010 American Newsweek article is laughable. It is full of nonsense of unnamed experts, with no relevance to Australia. Trying to equate Catholic clergy abuse in Australia to "normal" male levels of child abuse in the community is ridiculous and patently wrong.

A relevant study as reported in 'The Age' 2012.

"AT LEAST one in 20 Catholic priests in Melbourne is a child sex abuser, although the real figure is probably one in 15, the state inquiry (Victoria) into the churches' handling of sex abuse was told yesterday.

RMIT professor Des Cahill said his figures, based on analysing conviction rates of priests ordained from Melbourne's Corpus Christi College, closely matched a much larger American analysis of 105,000 priests which found that 4362 were child sex offenders."

"The intercultural studies professor also told the inquiry that the Catholic Church was incapable of reforming itself because of its internal culture. He said the Church's Melbourne Response abuse protocol had to go, and the state would have to intervene to achieve it."

Are you going to claim, 1 in 15, or 1 in 20, adult males in Australia are child sex abusers and the general populace is trying to cover it up?