runner,

You're excused...I wouldn't expect you to recognise "petty and vindictive".

'You're excused '

thanks Poirot. Not unlike you to place yourself as the adjudicator.

OUG excuse me while I lurch away from my threads intended line of travel.
You have done it hard, I too once battled just to eat.
We are no better or worse than any one for that.
I am a fool, we exist, we give too much and get too little.
But bloke know this, I like my great party, emerge far bettor for our loss.
And know too it is a reward, not a pain, to quietly help some one out.
See I never saw my party as all bad, we had filth beyond description in our ranks.
But look for few halos on the heads of the new government.
Know too Labor gives too much welfare Liberal take too much away from those in need.
Labor will see reform in welfare, complain about it, but change nothing when next in government.
We are in a place of silence, but watch the war start about mid next year.
I think, heart and sole, both sides should sit down and bargain right now.
On how to make the Senate a toothless Tiger, some give some take but please lets find a way around preferences conning us all.
Make the next Senate ticket 100mm square have Labor or Liberal *only no preference*
Make the Senate be a self interested idiots free zone.

Quite a few threads and thoughts about the Senate now active.
Just take this thought on board.
Under current rules , unlikely we can change them, we face a minimum of 6 years of a house said to be of review.
Being one of black mail.
And too never forget that in part, bought down the ALP, doing deals with a team unquestionably more disliked than liked the greens.

"And too never forget that in part, bought down the ALP, doing deals with a team unquestionably more disliked than liked the greens." Belly what planet are you on, still attacking the Greens, look at the results, half the seats Labor retained were on Green preferences, we lost nothing. On the other hand your party lost government, like it has all over Australia, lost a swag of seats, can't even find a leader, Shorten...Albo, what a dumbo duo they are, please get in touch with the political reality. Again I ask you to have a look at the result in the seat of Melbourne, it tells you where Labor is heading long term.
p/s even your leader Rudd would not have retained his seat without Green preferences.

Gday Paul, nice to see you back.
Honestly I like you but not all your posts.
Was your mum a needle worker? or was it Dad?
Lets look yet again at both houses not just the Senior sits house of rest/Senate.
In NSW we can vote once in the lower house, box one ignore the rest.
What is so wrong about that?
Why should *any chance exist* my ballot paper in any house any election put other than my intended vote and for candidate in office?
Tell me why my party and yours left *US* out of picking Senate preferences from *OUR VOTE* being distributed.?
How tell me, has Queensland suffered after an ALP government, in the year 1956? abolished the rest room/Senate.
How can a system restoring the will of the majority be undemocratic?
See ya bloke.