AB let us not get carried away.
I am as strongly left of center as you.
But trading in self deception is a form of self amusement.
Had JWH not let his bile against unions/workers run free he would still be PM.
It matters not what you or I think he gave the electorate what it wanted.
LATHAM! how can anyone quote the grubby person he was as evidence Howard was other than he was.
JWH killed his party and self by an action that bought about warfare in the workplace.
Labor/Unions must distance them selves from pointless propaganda.
Average Aussie, the people we must gather together or fail forever, will not buy other than truth.
I repeat I think his wife wore the trousers, but Labor can do well to understand he, unlike our current leader, worked on bringing others not his own to him.
It worked.

Dear Banjo,

In my first post of this discussion, I suggested that John Howard "was trying to spread fear and paranoia among Australians. Fear of terrorism, fear of refugees, fear of financial crisis, etc. ... Social management must not be based on fear, and human rights must never be sacrificed for any material benefits".
Therefore, it would be illogical for me to be involved in consideration of financial matters etc., which I believe are off topic concerning current discussion.
Also, off topic seems to be consideration of achievements and failures of current and former prime-ministers. Yet, it is relevant to notice that, unlike John Howard, neither Kevin Rudd nor Julia Gillard have ever been caught with any public lies such as about Iraq's weapons of mass distraction, children overboard, Haneef's affair, agreement with Peter Costello etc., and never decided to be involved in Iraq and Afghanistan wars. They inherited these problems from John Howard.
"To stop the physical and sexual abuse of aboriginal children and to improve their health and education" is very important, but this must be done only by democratic methods.
Attempts 'to improve democratic society by antidemocratic methods' can never be justified by their intentions and even achievements. Such a social management is unacceptable under any circumstances. This was a clear message to John Howard by his electorate when he was not re-elected.
Should not such a lesson be well learned?

Posted by one under god, Tuesday, 3 January 2012 9:05:53 AM

Dear Sir "under one god",

you must modify you habits first seriously cut back the amber fluid and the other..........your Mum told you it was bad for you and she was right!

Andreas,
You are dreaming, Howard did not promote fear of terrorist, he simply made us aware of the possibility of terrorist acts here and put in place laws to stop such acts. The recent jailing of some for planning such shows it was a good move. No fear of refugees either, Howard stopped the illegals because we do not like being conned by gate crashers.

Then you have the hide to declare financial matters 'off topic'. No wonder with the present governments blunders and waste, you would fail miserably there. Nor do you want to compare Howard to the past or present PMs because you would lose that debate also.

WE supported our allies in Iraq and Afghanistan. What about East Timor? should we have not become involved there? Previous governments simply stood aside and let Indonesia do as it pleased.

Frankly, I do not care if my or your human rights are a bit compromised if it leads to the prevention of kids being abused and improves their health and education. What about the kids human rights?

You need to get your priorities right.

AB,

Compared to the slow motion train wreck that is the Rudd Gillard Labor government, the Howard government was a huge success.

Wobbles,

The middle class welfare was an incentive to encourage behaviour that benefited the state. Health insurance rebate meant that the government needed to spend less on public health. Private school subsidies, meant that less money was spent on education with better results.

And yes the lowest paid workers real income increased more under Howard than Hawke.

shadow..you have a mind..[so use it]
john howrd talked about average wages
not minimum wages

the averge wage went up all the time
funny how the millions..from middle classes [upper managment]
increase the average...even if the real wage..of the lower classes is ever chewed away by ever increased prices...

if only their wage
was linked to the true inflation rate

if only their wage..wasnt stolen by the lie of income tax
[see wage ISNT income..its wager..INCOME is proffit
derived from no value adding]

rent/shares..bank-intrest..
rates fines fees bonus..etc

tax only income
not wage

dont be fooled by howhards..'average earnings..
or average wage
they arnt the same thing's

you must surely know this