I knew when starting this conversation not every comment would be rational.
And I knew and know still my views are not shared by some on both sides of the house.
Hence get the gum boots on and other comments.
RObert you are a balanced Conservative contributor, you always have been and I always will respect you.
My party must take the maggots out of the word Solidarity, we are far better than that, spive like covering up Pedophiles, Criminals, a host of other things.
Then claiming it is in SOLIDARITY with party/members, my fellow rank and file are not oil rags.
Yet I remain convinced, on every side of the house,good honest tryers out number trash.
I too, know, deeply think I understand, Liberalism is far better than work choices, and all to true Mr Tony Abbott is the worst leader that once great, will be great again, party ever had.
Put the blindness, bigotry, bias in the bin for a while.
Look with me at this truth, Conservatives state and federal have fallen under the very right faction.
Labor, not so long ago, looked more Liberal than Liberals.
NSW before Carr left was private property.
A truth exists here, while Labor rotted on the tree,NSW Liberals grew, it will take a record term of Conservative government here to remove them.
A greatly improved ALP comes in that time, better government too.
Abbott I fear, and believe, is dropping conservative policy's like wheat from a split bag.
In government he is bound to disappoint.
And bound too to be a one termer.
But if the Liberals have the people I think they have he will not lead by years end.
Both party's over value internal views and are blind to ours.

Work Choices I need to address this issue yet again.
Remember I am a life time trade Unionist.
And that I proudly was an official of our country's best union for the full period of work choices.
Devils advocate first, few will know why Howard hated Unions, he did, blindly.
Postal workers, in my view should have been imprisoned to a man for it, refused to deliver mail to our troops on active service.
Nothing else will do, left wing grubs leading blind fools and insult to workers groups, I never forgave them, nine tenth of union members never will.
Howard crafted a new union in his Ministerial office, grubby but I think most never cared.
BE AWARE workers 90% of them hate communists even socialists!
Howard needed to cripple the ALP election income, unlike self interested big business Labor would be easy meat with out it.

So work choices.
Some did do better on personal contract, no more than 5% and middle income workers.
I do not blame those who do not know, but think they do.
I have no need to lie, if I did I am worthless.
Kids 16 years old, first job out of school forced to give up penally rates sick leave holidays.
In a true light, as seen even by Abbott, work choices was cruel unjust and it ,not Labor lost Howard his seat.
The deliberate miss information, cover word for intentional lies, about growing strike action is a bit rude.
Agreements, masses of them, ran out last year and this.
It is at that time, no other unless related to safety, workers can strike.
NO OTHER TIME.
3 years cycle ending is the only reason .
Tell me, are your neighbors evil, is the bus driver a crook, has the postman the right to a living wage.
Are wage earners lessor?

Belly,
How about running a small business with about half a dozen employees for a while before you decide how much people should be paid.
Then, after the Government's hit you with all imaginable charges & fees a union bloke rolls up at your door & demands that you pay penalty rates as well.
Give us an update on how rich you are as a businessman & how you could easily afford to pay 16 year olds double time on weekends.
Why don't you forget about your union days of when you just demanded more & get in there & try to provide more. I'm sure you'd become pretty conservative in a very short time

"""
2012 a year that challenges the ALP
""

Hopefully it's the year they disappear under the rock they came from!

One is still allowed to dream aren't they? Or have they banned that too!?

I have often been seen as abrupt, angry,heated.
Blame my lack of formal education, its impacts on my posts construction.
I have zero understanding of grammar.
But yes, am a warrior, and stray at times.
Proud I try not to, am amused, extremely so, by the far, lost lefts TACTIC of telling me my views are heated heart bursting stuff.
Such Tactics signal their defeat, they do not have the ability to debate, are only a propagandas fixed on messages that sink in debate.
Look how ever at the last two posts.
Raw Mustard, can you for give me? you have assisted me build a view of you.
It seems you think you are hot stuff, that rather silly shell of a comment, always degrading the ALP are of worth.
Sorry I disagree, with it all, just maybe it is the best you can do?
Indy, well same as above, mate you in this thread inferred Witlam was leader of the conservatives!
I in fact employed 5 people plus myself, in a small business early in life.
Each got over award and by staying back 4 extra hours one night Friday of on full pay.
Facts do not dig holes and disappear every time one like you two post garbled unfounded insults.
In the end it is my fault, I ask too much of you both.
Rational, considered debate.
Indy, a last tip, the big fella was a Labor Prime Minister.

the big fella was a Labor Prime Minister. Don't worry I'll never forget Goaf Whitlam for ruining my plans.
Belly,
That's what I meant, he he did the most damage to this country hence being the worst leader..Also, to become the worst leader some pretty basic mentality supporters are needed.
So far as you having employed people successfully may well have been so in the days of reasonably sensible conservative led Government.