Dear Suze,

Thanks for this thread.
It has produced a wide range of reactions.
And, it's certainly been an interesting
discussion. You're to be Congratulated for
a job well done. My goodness look at how many
posted - nearing the 200 mark, and I suspect
it may even go over that. That's got to be
some sort of a record.

However, for me as well - this thread has now run its course.
Thanks once again.
I'll see you on another thread.

It has been a good thread suzeonline I must see it gets its 200.
While my thread would have been about pedophiles and the catholic church, surely most know its a problem for all?
This thread highlighted one church, those who want to confuse the issue baffle me.
Nothing can hide the failure to fix this, the hidden cases the lack of action over century's.
The more exposure this gets the more likely it will at last end.
In such threads as this, we have had many too many, I said we would again talk about it.
We have and we will yet again, this thread has seen contributors who appear not to care about the crime or the victims.
Tomorrows and even the year after next newspaper headlines will remind us it is not yet fixed.

Well done Suze.

Belly: >> ... this thread has seen contributors who appear not to care about the crime or the victims. <<

That's correct they would rather vilify adults who prefer other adults of the same sex.

Another point that evades the reasoning ability of the homophobes is that even if every homosexual was removed from religions, schools, wherever children congregate, paedophilia would still occur for the simple fact that most paedophiles are not same-sex oriented. It is the child that attracts them, not the gender, it is the ease with which they can control a child compared to an adult partner.

suzeonline,
You ask "I wonder why you have such a fascination about gay men?"
This is just the same, tired old homosexual canard, dripping with negative innuendo.
It’s the one that people pull from their bag of ad hominem insults when they have no logical argument to support their views.
It’s the baseless accusation that Paul Collins draws upon when he implies that only “closet queens” in the church criticise homosexual clergy.

On a more positive note.
Anyone can play the game. It’s easy.
I wonder why you, suzeonline, have such a fascination with child sex abuse?

Dear Proxy,

You need to stop twisting things around to suit your
own agenda.

Kindly re-read what Dr Collins actually said:

"It is clear that the accusation that gay priests
are more likely to be child molesters is totally
wrong, and lay Catholics have no problems with
gay clery whether they are "out," or more likely,
quietly integrating their sexual preference.

What PEOPLE find intolerable are the "closet queens"
who, in bouts of self-hatred and denial, are often
vicious in their attacks on other homosexual persons
demanding all types of punitive measures against
them. Self-hating clergy not only destroy themselves,
but are much more likely to project their venom outwards
and that can lead to extremely rigid and destructive
behaviour, especially for vulnerable people in pastoral
situations.

What the church needs to guard against specifically is
admitting this destructive type of person into the
seminary. Their rigidity and claims to pseudo-orthodoxy
are extremely dangerous and detrimental in pastoral
ministry..."

I'm extremely perplexed by your inability to comprehend
what Dr Collins is saying.

However, I shan't be responding to you any further.
It seems that you prefer to view things through a
very narrow lens so there's no point in further
discussion.

As Suze suggested - start your own thread on the subject
of homosexuality.

Proxy

Are you just running a diversionary tactic by continually harping on homosexuality?

Too many good people have wasted too much time trying to be reasonable to you.

Runner,

I’m amazed at your amazement…and yet I’m not amazed at it either…You have been so busy attacking homosexuals that I thought you might suffer from some sort of amazing comprehension disability.

Mjpb

Many institutions have been mentioned here…however the topic is headed “Child Sex Abuse and the Catholic Church” and we are supposed to stick to the topic.

Which organisation has “left no stone unturned to avoid child abuse?” If you are saying the Catholic Church then I think you should re-read many of the posts.

Isn't the world's media overturning many previously unturned stones that organisations have neglected to overturn?

Others

The LATIN 2001 letter allegedly from the former Cardinal (now Pope) Ratzinger ”DE DELICTIS GRAVIORIBUS” is found here in Latin…http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20010518_epistula_graviora%20delicta_lt.html

I found this alleged translation in English….http://www.bishop-accountability.org/resources/resource-files/churchdocs/EpistulaEnglish.htm

Some Key words in the translation are

1. “Cases of this kind are to be subject to the Pontifical Secret”

Here is a definition of “Pontifical Secret”…. http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Pontifical+Secret

Does this mean that a person can be excommunicated for even discussing these issues?...What does this say about free speech, openness and accountability in regards to child abuse cases?

OR

Is does this mean that a victim who communicates outside the Church can be ex-communicated?

OR

Does this mean that the details of serious offences must be kept in strictist confidence for the protection of all parties?

Does it say "ALL cases MUST be reported to the Police?

2. Here is an alleged English translation of Sacramentorum sanctitatis tutela issued by John Paul II…..http://www.september12009.com/images/pdfs/Sacramentorum%20Sanctitatis%20Tutela%20English.pdf

And here is the alleged Latin version…..http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/motu_proprio/documents/hf_jp-ii_motu-proprio_20020110_sacramentorum-sanctitatis-tutela_lt.html

Here is a list (in near chronological order) of the Lateline articles on ABC 2 where certain allegations were raised regarding one particular case.

http://search.abc.net.au/search/search.cgi?query=Anthony+Jones&sort=date&collection=abcall&form=simple&meta_v=lateline

Suze TY for this thread...