Yes Nicky, I followed the Saudi story, it is one story. It was taken
up by CNN, highlighted globally and I think in the end the King
pardoned her. You forget that the internet and satelite dishes
are changing the world, even in Saudi Arabia.

What we have in SA is no different from what we have had in the
West. Old Archbishop Pell still preaches the evils of condoms.
The Catholic Church used to have people like me burnt at the stake.

They can't do it any longer and similarly in SA the young are rebelling
against the old traditions and want change. The old ones
don't want change. Some of them need to die until it can happen,
but the pressures are enormous right through the ME.

Fact is that with the advent of the internet, the genie is out of
the bottle and the old brigage simply cannot put it back.

Typical of you, you mention one single restraining box in Egypt,
but what about the other 70 in Indonesia? Fact is Nicky, you
are unable to think objectively about the big picture,
you are far too obsessed.

By far the majority of MLA funding comes from farmers in the way
of levies. Yes, the Govt makes a contribution dollar for dollar,
for research projects etc. If another 10 million was spent tomorrow
for installing proper slaughter equipment in the ME, I for one would
be thrilled, as animals would benefit

Nicky, One of the three charges was "proven beyond reasonable doubt" the one relating to "fat sheep in november", of which there were 4010 aboard a shipment of 103 000. You cannot say "charges" truthfully when only one charge would have stuck under the WA act.
The other two charges were not proven and thus dimissed. It's in the findings, I'm not sure why you continue to argue to the contrary.

flogging etc is just a cop out Nicky, that's a "too hard lets not try" mentality. Does that make it easier to turn a blind eye to it all but Australian animals? At least the meat industry here is trying to do something.

"handful" - oodles better than none. One would hope any lessons learned could be applied to non-aussie animals too. How many AA personnel are over there training stock handlers?

yep, moral positions will save the day "Given the fact that we are talking about people who still publically flog, imprison and stone to death female rape victims". Take your own advice, for what it's worth.

I'm quite sure the North African countries which supplied during Australias past market absence, and who seem to share similar religious beliefs, will be more than happy for Australia to withdraw from live-export. Won't do their sheep any favours though.

I was thinking too,...

Nicky
What Can I say- you’re wrong. Also and I have to pick my words so not to offend. your work is known and respected. Look you know you have a better handle on many of the aspects.

Tell you what. Robert can post you and ask you himself. He’s read your comments along with others and said- Ask her to contact me. We will do it. I can only pass it on.

You might find a team of lawyers a bit refreshing in a way because they only look at the legal side with I will say a totally different approach which has been taken before. I think you should at least talk to him. Then if you’re not interested- nothing lost. They are not asking you to sue just supply your unique background on ships- he needs that.
Ok I won’t nag- look for his post is all I can say. There are several of them who are willing to help.

Nicky Said
I do think that the Australian public should be told exactly how many taxpayer dollars have gone to MLA for live export support though.
Pale.
Yes I know but it’s the massive time and resources to follow the blood trails. I mean we would have to include all the enquires that the public purse has paid for over the last twenty years and trust me they refuse to disclose and that’s millions upon millions of the publics money. For EG how would I work out what’s still going through AWB live exports. I can promise you they would still be paying, err, road transport. So do you think the Australian public would be happy about that? Umm, perhaps we should expose more but its time. I am working 16 to 20 nows- You can’t be far behind me.

Funds going through one department to another and another and back again passed on as so called grants for buildings and land that doesn’t even exist.

Anyway, thanks I will think about it.

Yabby

Gertrude is so badly informed ..

I make a point of telling YOU most if not ALL these projects are HKMs!

And this one in particular belongs 100%to the girls you are debating! And other Animal minded people.

all hells going to break loose – Very Soon! Do not tell me I don’t know what’s going on behind the
Scene pls.!

http://www.halaljournal.com/?page=article&act=show&pid=1487&PHPSESSID=6c39a74c8d4d420d6c75aa2aa2a20cee

Gertrude btw doesn’t have to know every cut of beef to have a beef up with MLA Yabby; Gertrude has her own unique evidence.

My God I even had one head MLA tells me there was nothing going on with Malaysia.

Didn’t know Mohamed while I was looking at him standing right next to Mohamed and the Malaysian Minister at a meeting I ORGANISED! Dur!

Then you have Ian Ross – (Head of MLA tell you in person that NOTHING will ever be assisted that competes with LIVE EXPORTS.

I note you shied like a horse away from the posts I put up done by the Malaysian Government and industry.

Information never made public before in this country. Let’s take a look and see what Livcorpre and MLA are up to with OUR Australians public purse while defying RSPCA and other Animal Welfare organizations shall we.

Yabby you would even know 20% of the tricks of the trade to cycle funding.

The truth IS Yabby it is only those with vetted interests with contacts with Government and other involved industries that are stopping the Aussie Farmers getting on board this-
http://www.worldhalalforum.org/

This is an important gathering to discuss and share ideas on how to push the halal agenda further forward…Malaysia continues to be open and keen to work with other countries in advancing the global halal industry .towards this end, the World Halal Forum and its programmers can provide an effective platform due to its focused agenda and wide ranging reach”

Datuk Seri Hj Abdullah Ahmad Badawi
The Prime Minister of Malaysia

Not only Malaysia but other countries. You only have to look here to see how the meat Industry makes or breaks a country.=

http://www.halaljournal.com/index2.php?page=article&act=show&pid=1480

Hi all
Just a last quick one ... PALE, there is an excellent document at www.liveexportshame.com called "A Disaster by Another Name" which details pretty much every ship that I've heard of, and some that I haven't. From what I can gather it was researched through the Fairplay International Register of Shipping and AMSA defect and detention records, and it has photographs too. Your Robert may be interested in looking for that. It's a bit tricky to find though - tell him to search the site for "A Disaster..." and go for the updated version (late 2006/early 2007) I think.

AMSA lists ship detentions on its website under the Port State Control link (the Deneb Prima was holed up in Port Adelaide for some days in September last year over safety and fire hazard defects, for example. Read about the Torrens (the former Farid F) the terrible too - it's still transporting cattle from Australia, I think.

Nite all
Nicky

Nicky

Thanks, I will tell him buts that just one part of it I am afraid. In order to do something successful in the courts he and his lawyers friends would require someone to do the leg work= which mostly involves supplying them a full background.
Much of this history took place well before our involvment with Animal Welfare.
I am sure anything can be researched but the costs would be enourous especially considering the time involved. Then theres the chance something would be overlooked etc.

Nothing like someone Savvy with All of the background to brief them.

Then I have to weigh up the quickest way to the long term result. Lets say for eg the Government banned live exports overnight.
That would create a monumental problem in itself - especially short term.

This is one of the reasons why we created HKM to put the alternative on the table which blocks people like yabby making claims that people like us have no idea of what we are doing.

So all things considered we think as much as we would love to take on the courts our time is best spent introducing new projects and reopening plants throughout Australia.

To stand by the red meat industry does not mean we agree with feed lots or some other issues.

What it does do is start to head in the direction of a very long journey. To support or unite with others effected by the unfair Government and Industry policies purposely directed the promote the evil vile trade of exporting Animals still alive purley for a trade dollars gain - for a very few is the first step.

More than once- more than a thousand times I have questioned if we should go all out and do the legal thing- BUT Its would still require some form of co-operation from others to brief the silk.

That co operation was refused.
I have no reason to believe that position has shifted.