I tell you what if this woman was the love of someones life...

You think a peaceful man would not be driven psychotic with nothing but revenge on their mind and little to lose?
What if the kids are dead too?

How many Israelis do you think a man might be willing to take out to avenge the love of his life and his children?
How many would need to die to avenge a senseless killing of the one person in the world you love more than all others?
Just the one who did it, or 100 or 1000, because THEY ALL DID IT.

I'll leave that question up to each of you men who has ever loved a woman.

How many more videos like this would you like to see?
All the real gory ones get taken down pretty quickly.

I really hope someone compiled all of the horrible damn footage into a full length documentary movie, so the world never forgets what was done here, but alas, the world barely even knows the level of atrocities already.

Israel murdered the journalists as well.

Now let me get this straight. You say "every credible estimate converges around 10-11 million". I show you a bunch that have much higher figure.
And you think that confirms you point. Struth what a dill.

"So it’s not that there are fewer undocumented immigrants, it’s that some may have left before being deported. "

What? That doesn't make the slightest sense and shows how desperate you are to salvage a failed assertion. If they left, then there's fewer of them. Is logic tooooo hard for you to follow?

"Harvard/Harris poll didn’t ask about facial-recognition AI, masked raids, or surveillance of ICE critics. Support for deporting criminals isn’t carte blanche for domestic surveillance."

Well I didn't say it did. But go ahead and try to change the subject now that you realise you've painted yourself into yet another corner.

"because the latest NYT/Siena poll shows Trump leading Biden on immigration perception"

So you didn't check the poll. Good idea. Wouldn't want to see something that made you look even more foolish. FYI the most recent NYT/Sienna poll showed 54% support deporting all illegals.

You really should quit while you're behind.

Hi AC,

"Really, that's what you think?
How many Israeli women did Palestinians shoot dead for no reason yesterday?"

Well look at it this way: Just say there was a report on a Russian atrocity in Ukraine, say a bombing of a hospital, school, railway station, people sheltering in a theatre, a family in a car etc. How would you explain that? You might say that the Ukrainians killed their own to make Russia look bad (as with the civilian slaughter in Buchar), or you might suggest that the target was full of Ukrainian soldiers who were cleared away before the filming started. So why the different treatment for Israel? Wouldn't the deaths of women and kids be more likely as Hamas fight with their women and kids about them?

I try to be consistent.

Not quite, mhaze.

//You say 'every credible estimate converges around 10-11 million'. I show you a bunch that have much higher figure. And you think that confirms you point.//

You listed four sources. Three cluster between 14-15.4 million. Only one claims 18. None say 20. All count differently, some including expired visas or extrapolating beyond census data. That’s not convergence toward your "10-20 million" claim - it’s drift, not confirmation.

The credible middle - Pew, MPI, CMS, and DHS itself - sits around 10-11 million, especially for long-term undocumented residents. You just moved the goalposts from "nobody knows" to "here’s a handful of higher estimates" and called it checkmate.

//If they left, then there's fewer of them.//

Yes, but your original claim suggested Trump’s policies actively deported them. I pointed out that many self-deported, and that distinction matters. Fear-based flight isn’t policy success. It’s the absence of due process, and proof that ICE’s shift from law enforcement to intimidation worked too well.

You follow now?

//But go ahead and try to change the subject...//

You brought up support for deportation. I pointed out the poll you cited didn’t ask about ICE’s surveillance powers, masked raids, or sentiment-tracking AIs. That’s not changing the subject. It’s clarifying that support for one tactic doesn’t equal support for all.

//So you didn't check the poll...//

I did check it. You're right that 54% said yes to that specific question. But just as before, that doesn’t mean they support ICE's methods, surveillance programs, or military-style raids. Nor does it mean mass deportation is feasible, affordable, or moral.

If all you're proving is that bare majorities support harsh-sounding policies when asked in isolation, that’s not news. It's been that way for decades. It still doesn’t excuse masked raids on cities with legal sanctuary policies or warrantless surveillance of critics.

//You really should quit while you're behind.//

That line might sting more if you weren’t backing an administration that wants to monitor people’s selfies for "negative sentiment," and refers to half the population as "the enemy within."

I'm fine staying behind if it means not applauding that.

Hi Fester

'as with the civilian slaughter in Bucha'
- Yes that's true, and same as the Mariupol Drama Theatre incident which was attributed to a Russian airstrike.
- Both of those WERE false flag attacks.

'or you might suggest that the target was full of Ukrainian soldiers who were cleared away before the filming started.'
- a military target is a military target but it's against the Geneva convention to place them in civilian areas, or cause excessive civilian casualties, it's the same argument he West selectively uses for Gaza that Palestinians are used as human shields.
- Yet if you look at the level of damage in Gaza, you can't argue there was Hamas in every single building when it's flattened everything.
How much civilian casualties are deemed acceptable?
U.S. has certainly done so in large numbers.
For me, well I'm glad I don't have to make that call because I simply don't support the deliberate harm of non combatants.

Other explanations you didn't mention in Ukraine, relates to large quantities of drones, missiles and interceptors to take them down, sometimes 2 interceptors are fired at a single drone or missile to ensure a high success rate, if the target hits, all this debris falls somewhere, including when the interceptors don't hit their targets.

If a Ukrainian interceptor inadvertently falls from the sky and lands on a residential building, then it was a 'Russian missile, and it was a deliberate attack'.

And the difference between Russia and Israel, is that Israel deliberately targets civilians, doctors, nurses, first responders, journalists, women, kids etc.

Add to that, Israels real goal is to drive out or kill all the people in Gaza and the West Bank and expand it's territory.

http://ukraine.ohchr.org/en/Ukraine-s-Civilians-Face-Daily-Death-and-Injury-Amid-Intense-Attacks-UN-Human-Rights-Monitors-Say

"Kyiv, 10 October 2025 – At least 214 civilians were killed and almost 1,000 injured across Ukraine in September 2025, marking another devastating month, particularly for communities along the frontline who remained at the epicenter of harm, the UN Human Rights Monitoring Mission in Ukraine..."

7 civilians per day across a 1200 klm line of contact.
Compare that to Gaza.

This is the last on this ridiculous subthread. You have this childish view that the last person to talk wins and so you keep coming up with utter rubbish just to avoid admitting you got it wrong.

All I said was that the number was between 10-20 million. You haven't found a single fact, NOT A SINGLE FACT, to show that's wrong. And so you start trying to redefine what I said and what you said before you realised how stupid your original comments were. Its as though I say that Australian men are between 5'6" and 6'6" tall and you say no they're all around 5'7" and then when I prove that the average is around 6' you claim that proves your point!! !!. And then to hide your error you start talking about shoe sizes.

Same with the question of how many people have left the US. I said there were 2.5million less illegals now as compared to when Trump came in. You haven't found a single fact, NOT A SINGLE FACT, to show that's wrong. and so you start trying to say that the people who left voluntarily don't count... or something. Why don't they count? Who knows. Certainly not you. But you need to make that stupid claim to square the circle.

And then I say that most USians support the removal of illegals and you dispute it. Then when I prove it, you start trying to change the subject to claim that most don't support some of the tactics used to get the illegals out. And that might be true, but isn't at all what I originally said.

Its the stupidest of patterns. I make a point. You don't want it to be true and say its wrong. I prove its right and then you try to save some face by redefining the original point.

Not playing.

You are quite the disappointment. When you first joined I thought I'd found a worthy counterpoint. But alas the last two threads have been a mess for you.