Nicely put, Lucy Montgomery.

>>Free speech is one thing, but being obnoxious is not a virtue, as much as some people think it is.<<

We certainly have our fair share of "free speech" advocates here, don't we.

>>Islam is a mental disease, a boil on the bum of humanity.<<

Wow, thanks for that insight, Glorfindel.

>>too many years of Islamic teaching has lead to values that are totally contrary to the educated and in the main, cultured population of Europe.<<

rexw is probably thinking here about the Islamic notions of chastity, their avoidance of alcohol and so on. So terribly, terribly un-European.

>>Islam is a form of Nazism. It has a totalitarian vision of society. Like the Nazis before them, Islamics exercise power through terror and intimidation.<<

A well-balanced, detached and mature worldview is always a joy to read, stevenlmeyer.

Last week's Economist carried an article on the integration of Muslims into US society.

http://www.economist.com/world/unitedstates/displaystory.cfm?story_id=15211698

It encapsulates the antics of the snarling rednecks quite admirably.

"Obnoxious pundits pour petrol on the flames. Michael Savage, a talk-radio host, describes the growth of America’s Muslim population as 'throat-slitters…clawing at the gate'"

Ok people, go get those petrol cans. Time for another free hit.

"If you look closely at some of the anti-Muslim posts on this thread there are some serious exaggerations and misleading statements." Lucy Montgomery.

To truly understand the chaos Islam has caused, you need to see what is happening to Islamic countries. Read the websites by ex- Muslims such as http://www.faithfreedom.org and http://www.islam-watch.org and realise what Islam has done to Muslims.

Islamic countries are usually failed states and there are millions of Muslims trying to get to the West. Yet they can’t see the main cause of their failure is Islam. Many insist on implementing shariah law in the land they migrated, and they try very hard to establish the evil ideology of Islam that has kept the Muslim mind in the dark.

Muslims are just like everyone else but Islam has made them backward, violent and irrational. Just see what happened to Malaysia recently http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cV89G-wrgDQ (Muslims run amok burning churches).

It took China about half a generation (30 years) to grow from a backward country to a world power and becoming a manufacturing hub. This they did by completely abandoning dogmatic Marxism and putting to practice the true socialism of hard work.

Obama can send billions and billions of money to Muslims in Afghanistan but they will still be as backward, lazy and irrational because of Islam

The Missus wrote: "Called cultural genocide is it not?"

No its not. Don't exaggerate.

Could be, entirely up to the country to decide if they feel it is. Nobody here has any real say or right to an opinion on it. Simply none of our business. Especially when change is forced on people, or they feel it is, up to them to have a say without bores interfering.

Pericles.

You accuse me and others of rednecked rabble-rousing, lack of balance and hypocrisy (eg on Islam's ideas of chastity and avoidance of alcohol). Actually, Islamic chastity is not about faithfulness, but about sexual inequality and repression that engenders pathological prurience and unhealthy relations between the sexes. Remember Al-Hilaly’s admission that Muslim men could only be dogs in the presence of “uncovered meat”? But yes, Western binge drinking is disgraceful.

You advance no defences of Islam, only attack those who describe its awful record. Invective isn't argument. And political correctness is HYPOCRISY. Your alias ‘Pericles’ recalls classical Greek democracy. Can I draw your attention to “democracy” in Iran today? Egypt? Sudan? Somalia? Pakistan? Afghanistan? Saudi Arabia? And…?

I won't ask you if, in your enlightened tolerance, you'd defend the US Religious Right. (OK, it’s not very attractive.) But I bet you'd badmouth even the Sydney Anglicans. It's OK to rubbish Christians and those who think the broad Western heritage is worth defending.

Old son, the mullahs, ayatollahs and other sunshines of the Middle East, Iran and Pakistan would eat you and your kind for breakfast, soon as they found out your views on, say, pluralist democracy, free speech and inquiry, tolerance of diversity, female rights, homosexuality, freedom to have or not have a religion, and so on.

Those attitudes are hypocritical, self-abasing, contemptible. So many of your postings have been remarkable for their negativity, their sneering at anything positive, their preparedness to bend over backwards to defend the indefensible. You are the guy who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last.

Nothing has changed since President Musharraf of Pakistan told a conference on science and technology attended by Ministers from Muslim countries in early 2002 :
"Today we [Muslims] are the poorest, the most illiterate, the most backward, the most unhealthy, the most un-enlightened, the most deprived, and the weakest of all the human race."

Name a few positive things that might justify Islam. Too hard? Can I finish by putting you on the spot. Would you consider becoming a Muslim? No? Oh, WHY NOT?

Lucy wrote:

"A person should be able to live here without being vilified because of their race or religion".

No one should be subject to attack or ridicule on account of their race.

But religion?

Why ever not?

You have yet to explain why a belief system or ideology should be immune from critique analysis satire and scorn simply because it is labelled a religion.

Presumably you would have no objections if I attacked someone for expressing Nazi beliefs. But supposing they wrapped their beliefs in religion which is what the "Christian Identity" movement does. Must I now "respect" Nazi beliefs?

"Narrated Abu Huraira:

Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until you fight with the Jews, and the stone behind which a Jew will be hiding will say. "O Muslim! There is a Jew hiding behind me, so kill him."

(Sahih Bukhari, Volume 4, Book 52, Number 177):

And yes, Lucy, I have heard Imams preach on exactly this hadith. It also seems to be a favourite among TV preachers in the Middle-East. Am I supposed to respect this because it is religion?

Should I fail to ridicule claims of being "chosen" by a psychopath in the sky?

Am I supposed to take seriously the claim that an itinerant Jewish preacher who happened to be God incarnate rose from the dead in first century "Palestine"?

Or that the creator of the universe, no less, told a seventh century merchant-warrior "The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides, or exile from the land: that is their disgrace in this world, and a heavy punishment is theirs in the Hereafter" (5:33)

Get real Lucy. These claims are risible and labelling them religion should not make the immune from ridicule.

See also:

http://www.youtube.com/user/ExMuslimUK#p/u/6/JSfQrMvuGf0 (EXCELLENT!)

Unless we are free to challenge all beliefs - robustly -we cannot have a democracy. That's the bottom line.

Ah, you noticed, Glorfindel.

>>You advance no defences of Islam<<

Very perceptive of you.

I am not in the habit of defending Islam, or any other religion.

What I do object to is people such as yourself filling this forum with your bile.

I consider your dedication to constant denigration to be corrosive to society at large.

As you yourself point out...

>>Invective isn't argument<<

Yet, despite this insight, you provide us with such gobbets as:

>>Islam is a mental disease, a boil on the bum of humanity.<<

Be honest with yourself for a moment. Is that an argument that you are presenting? Or simply your opinion, framed in the manner typical of your self-righteousness.

But your blindness isn't complete, because you quite correctly point out that I "advance no defences" of Islam.

I've already told you why. Which makes your next sneer totally redundant.

>>Can I finish by putting you on the spot. Would you consider becoming a Muslim? No? Oh, WHY NOT?<<

Why, oh why do you people always believe that it is necessary to belong to - or even identify with - a particular religious cult?

>>It's OK to rubbish Christians and those who think the broad Western heritage is worth defending.<<

Again, a significant misperception.

I have no problem with Christiantiy. Some of my best friends are Christians. Some of those are also evangelical, and enjoy a brisk discussion on my commitment to atheism versus their commitment to Christianity.

But they don't spend their time finding new and different ways to insult everyone who doesn't share their views, nor scour the world for examples of how evil other people are.

Your religion has been - and still is - responsible for murders, daily, around the world. Other religions have been - and still are - responsible for murders, daily, around the world.

There's a common theme there, which one day you might spot.

Not yet though. You are still too deeply immersed in your fear and loathing to join the dots.

>>You accuse me and others of rednecked rabble-rousing<<

Yep. Would you like to deny it?