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The Forum > Article Comments > Beyond minarets: Europe’s growing problem with Islam > Comments

Beyond minarets: Europe’s growing problem with Islam : Comments

By Shada Islam, published 19/1/2010

Can one be both European and Muslim?

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Half the story only, eyejaw.

>>...Darwish... was prevented from speaking (due to Muslim 'pressure') at both Princeton and Columbia universities. Columbia did however invite and allow to speak unhindered that liberal the President of Iran.<<

According to other sources, Darwish was prevented from speaking by an alliance between campus Jews and Muslims.

http://pajamasmedia.com/phyllischesler/2009/11/19/princeton-columbia-cancel-free-speech-darwish-silenced/

"...the Director of Hillel, a rabbi, as well as the Jewish group 'Tigers for Israel,' literally conspired with the Muslim chaplain on campus to cancel Darwish at the last moment."

Food for thought, eh?

And you omitted to mention that Columbia had the previous year cancelled an invitation to President Ahmadinejad.

http://www.nysun.com/new-york/columbia-withdraws-an-invitation-to-ahmadinejad/40142/

Perhaps they should simply invite Ms Chesler again. It worked for the Iranian President. Or perhaps they feel that if they did so, the publicity value of the first refusal would be compromised?

>>Darwish, together with Hirsi Ali should be compulsory reading for all who wish to comment about Islam in Western countries. Pericles please note!<<

If you look really carefully at my post, I made no comment whatsoever on "Islam in Western Countries", outside pointing to the fact that the statistics rexw gave us were, to say the least, extremely wobbly.

And if you look really, really carefully at my previous posts on the subject of whack-a-mozzie bigots, they predominantly address that cohort's tendency towards shrill, emotional chicken-littling.

In my view, the fear and loathing demonstrated by those folk in their diatribes against Islam is akin to attempting to douse a fire by throwing petrol on it. Whether they feel so or not, it is nothing more than self-righteous rabble-rousing.
Posted by Pericles, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 3:50:14 PM
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"I also stated that Darwish has excellent qualifications: she was prevented from speaking (due to Muslim 'pressure') at both Princeton and Columbia universities."

A person with excellent qualifications would have a degree from Princeton and Columbia. Darwish has neither. She's just another writer who is making a living out of peddling myths about the "Islamic threat." She was invited to speak at Columbia by student groups -- so she was not invited formally by the university itself. The student groups withdrew the invitation after pressure from other students, mainly Muslim students. Now those students have a legitimate right to protest against a speaker who they think defames them as a group.

So the whole thing isn't as sinister as Darwish and her supporters make out. Basically, she's just a Muslim Melanie Phillips. There is a lot of money in hysteria!

But I love this quote most of all:
"Islam is a form of Nazism. It has a totalitarian vision of society. Like the Nazis before them, Islamics exercise power through terror and intimidation."

Thats so stupid that I don't know where to begin. Was the lobotomy painful?
Posted by David Jennings, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 4:31:48 PM
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Now Pericles, don't get cross because some people disagree with you. You start well and logically. I shall certainly look up the links suggested though they do seem to give a different slant on things compared to what I had seen previously.

However you last three little paragraphs are not your normal standard at all. Phrases such as 'wack-a mozzie bigot', ''self righteous rabble rousing' and 'shrill emotional chicken littling' add nothing to the discussion. The rather sarcastic tone is not becoming.

I am rather puzzled at your statement that you are not commenting on Islam in Western countries. Passing strange surely in a comment on an article that is totally about Europe and Islam within Europe. Do you mean that your comment is about another article, not this one?

Chicken Little is a nice story about illogical fear of a small, tiny threat. I do not see Islam as a small threat to Western democracy. I wish it were of course, but the evidence is too great for me to think that.

I have atated that I will take the advice that Pericles gave and look up the links suggested. A quid pro quo is that Pericles should read Darwish, for I am confident she/he would not condemn her as a bigot or rabble rouser or shrill emotional etc without reading what she says. Hence she/he has not read her work yet, so she/he should.

One thing thatI think Pericles and I would agree on is that this is a most important issue. It is hence sad to see that it has not been read all that much.
Posted by eyejaw, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 4:34:35 PM
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The West benefited from a period of history called The Enlightenment when critical views covered literature and religion.It taught accomodation and challenge and people absorbed the outcome and were able to live comfortably with it and develop. This cultural evolution was unavailable in Islamic countries that are now being exposed to its influences.One has only to visit the local libraries and book shops to see the plethora of Muslim women and men coming out and expresing their views openly.
Pakistan is an example of fundamentalist provincially based conservatives on the one hand and educated upper class Western oriented Muslims who enjoy a scientific sort of education in the metroploitan areas on the other hand . The agony of co-existence is clear for all to see.

This evolution will be slow in coming into the whole Muslim world because of the violence of the ignorant, backward but amply endowed from the Wahabi community but it will come even if it takes a long time. We will not be alive to see it. I have faith that a new and vibrant Islam will emerge triumphant.
Posted by socratease, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 4:54:26 PM
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The West may have had the Enlightenment but strangely enough that period in history overlapped with the Inquisition, Slavery and the Napoleonic Wars.

Here is a radical suggestion - maybe Muslims are as diverse and as intelligent as we are. Maybe not every enriching, rewarding and valuable cultural or intellectual innovation emanates from the West.

Islam does not represent a threat to the West. A small group of radical extremists do - any they may use Islam as a cover. But anybdy who has read the Bible knows that it cn be used for all sorts of purposes. We should also know that poverty breeds extremism and that as some Muslim countries are also less-developed-countries, extremists have sprung up. We experienced exactly the same thing when facism took off in Germany, Italy and Spain and when Communism took off in Russia.

Btw Nonie Darwish isn't hysterical. She's very intelligent. She knows exactly what to write so as to play off the fears of her Western audience, who are largely ignorant of Islam, so that she can sell more books. Now thats very smart. Not moral - but definitely smart.
Posted by David Jennings, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 5:06:16 PM
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Ther is a simple question here that needs an answer. The Author say Europe must embrace Islam, My question is Why?

As a European I wonder why Ms Islam doesn't move to the MiddleEast, Would she feel welcome there?
Posted by Kenny, Tuesday, 19 January 2010 5:14:21 PM
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