The Forum > Article Comments > Beyond minarets: Europe’s growing problem with Islam > Comments
Beyond minarets: Europe’s growing problem with Islam : Comments
By Shada Islam, published 19/1/2010Can one be both European and Muslim?
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Posted by stevenlmeyer, Wednesday, 20 January 2010 8:06:30 PM
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I always have a problem with these OLO essays on Islam. Invariaby they are about how the host country should make them feel welcome and assist them in integrating ---those that really want to that is, and how we misunderstand them and make life difficult etc
But when you go to source of the matter it is what they believe that is the problem, and the more devout and believing they are, the less likely they are to integrate. http://www.newenglishreview.org/custpage.cfm/frm/28244/sec_id/28244 This essay looks at the problem in a measured way Posted by bigmal, Wednesday, 20 January 2010 8:38:36 PM
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'Should Muslims Asscociate With Non-muslims (kuffar), Your input would be greatly appreciated'
http://muslimvillage.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=56350&st=0 And herein rests the problem. The question is inherently bigoted but is repeatedly asked by Muslims of all kinds because religious taboos (Islam has more than you can poke a stick at) are often confused for real morality. The apprehension that many Muslims feel with regards to 'outsiders' is little different to the apprehension that the Klu Klux Klan have toward black people - "Oh no, we might become contaminated". The problem is not so much Europe or Europeans, but Islamic ideology itself. It is bigoted by definition. Posted by TR, Wednesday, 20 January 2010 10:16:05 PM
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I am sick of people making excuses for Islam - for its violence, obscurantism, barbarity towards women, intolerance towards other faiths and even strands within itself, its hostility towards democracy, human rights, and critical thinking.
Islam is a mental disease, a boil on the bum of humanity. Samuel Huntington (The Clash of Civilizations) speaks of the Islamic world’s “bloody borders and bloody entrails”. It is riddled with violence with neighbouring civilizations and within itself – Gaza strip, Lebanon, Iraq. How can one not despise such a culture? On balance, I cannot think of a single justification for its foundation. Islam does not claim to be a religion of love - quite the reverse. Christianity has been let down by many of its claimed practitioners in the past, but it is impossible to say that Jesus Christ taught violence, cruelty, impatience and hate. The trouble with Islam is not just Islamism. Taken seriously in terms of its own theology (and yes I have read and annotated the whole of the Koran), Islam is a vile, medieval, repressive and offensive religion. It has no place in a modern, tolerant and civilized Europe or Australia. Once could weep many tears over the dreadful treatment of women through genital mutilation, 'honour' killings, and stonings (almost invariably of women), and the disgusting amputations of hands under sharia law, and the repressive Muslim attitude towards apostasy (converting out of the faith - still outlawed in Malaysia as well as the hellholes around Arabia), and the violence toward Christian churches and individual Christians that occurs all the time. Muslims complain at a minaret ban - where are the churches in the Islamic world? There is no modernization or reformation for Islam - it is beyond saving. Like the "desolation before Mordor" described in The Lord of The Rings, the Islamic world is "the lasting monument to the dark labour of its slaves that should endure when all its purposes were made void; a land defiled, diseased beyond all healing -- unless the Great Sea should enter it and wash it with oblivion.” Like Sam, 'I feel sick.' Posted by Glorfindel, Wednesday, 20 January 2010 10:39:59 PM
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It is unbelievable that Geert Wilders has been charged in court for his criticism of Islam. http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/0,1518,672925,00.html
Wilders makes the distinction between the Muslim people and the Islamic ideology. No incitement to kill or hurt Muslims in Holland yet he is persecuted for speaking the truth about Islam. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8LJ-dyqDR0&feature=related Ayaan Hirsi Ali comes out in support of Geert Wilders. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwOCUuILJIg Error in link to Wafa Sultan on youtube in my earlier post. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zdN234Bp9w Wafa Sultan an Arab psychologist observed why devout Muslims are psychologically and mentally defective, “it is impossible for any human being to read the life of Muhammad and believe in it, yet emerge a psychologically and mentally healthy person” http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zdN234Bp9w Posted by Philip Tang, Thursday, 21 January 2010 2:11:39 AM
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The Missus wrote: "Called cultural genocide is it not?"
No its not. Don't exaggerate. Steven, the RRT Act is in place not to censor but to keep a standard of decency and civility in public discourse. A person should be able to live here without being vilified because of their race or religion. If you look closely at some of the anti-Muslim posts on this thread there are some serious exaggerations and misleading statements. Free speech is one thing, but being obnoxious is not a virtue, as much as some people think it is. Posted by Lucy Montgomery, Thursday, 21 January 2010 6:25:43 AM
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You are missing my point.
I know what the law states.
But my point is this:
THERE SHOULD BE NO SUCH LAWS.
I can think of no good reason why any belief system should be afforded special protection from critique, analysis, satire and scorn simply because it is labelled a "religion".
Laws such as Victoria's Racial and Religious Tolerance Act are censorship. We are imposing censorship on ourselves simply to appease religious folk. I, for one, have no intention of being bound by what amount to modern-day blasphemy laws.