Thanks, Goodthief, just happened to have played a lot of sport. And as we know good sportsmen do try to get togther and share the blame, as happened recently with us and the Indian cricketers.

But sharing the blame, of course, like forced to shake hands or kissing one's wife in front of the kids after an argument is possibly the simplest but most wonderful example in the pursuit of peace.

CJ,

i just didn't want to confuse anyone, that's all.

You have now finally admitted that the behaviours of some Muslims have contributed to anti-Islamic sentiment. Reasonable people can quibble about how much it has to do with it, but its good that you have finally moderated on this one.

I still think that there is little evidence of social alienation producing terrorists. To repeat, those failed terrorists in England had not been marginalised at all.

To repeat, terrorism involves the accepting of ideas that together can be described as the "Islamist narrative". Often it's young and impressionable minds being influenced by radical Muslims and then persuaded to plan a terrorist attack. No social alienation is necessary in this process. To believe that Muslims are being victimised, it is not necessary for you, as a Muslim to have been victimised.

Ginx

I’m shocked and dismayed by your devastating attack on my species.

It’s not my fault I was born green and slimy. You are obviously a “Frogophobe”. Also, you don’t seem to believe in the Great Green Toad God in the sky, and my religion Frogism...

I feel completely misunderstood, maligned, marginalised, victimised, alienated, etc etc…

For years you’ve eaten our legs, experimented upon us in laboratories, destroyed our ponds…

What is worse, you even deny the truth of our wonderful religion, Frogism, and the prophet Froggo (pbuh), who came among us many years ago to spread the news of the true way to the Great Green Toad...

One day you’re going to regret this, and Frogism will take over the whole world. For didn’t the Prophet Froggo say, “kill the unbelievers wherever you find them”? And aren’t there two parts to the world “Dar al Frog and Dar al Harb?

Gosh, I’m really mad now.

I think I’ll go out and bomb a shopping centre or a railway station, and kill a few innocent bystanders. Or cut a few heads off.

If there are any frogs there, well too bad, they probably weren’t true Frogists anyway.

:-)

wobbles, You say – “Maybe when the Muslims are able to stand shoulder-to-shoulder with the rest of us and attack some other group, they will finally be accepted as part of the community.” I wish I could be optimistic about this happening. Are you optimistic?

I suppose we were pessimistic about, say, Vietnamese assimilation in the 1970s(?), and that our pessimism has proved to be groundless. Yet, I think that pessimism really was phobic and a kind of reflex, whereas pessimism about Muslim assimilation has a stronger basis:

i) a lot of Muslims in the West seem to hate the West – and many of them are happy to say so. I never noticed this with other immigrant groups.

ii) we see this in every Western country that I’m aware of that hosts Muslims, and the ethnicity of the Muslims doesn’t seem to make a difference.

I know Paul. L has pointed out these things.

If Cronulla was considered in isolation, we might speak of the chicken and the egg. But, Islam’s track record is devastatingly relevant.

I don’t know how to avoid the conclusion that the problem is inherent in the religion of Islam – although I suppose it may be the Arabic culture that has accompanied or driven much of Islamic proselytism. What do you think of this possibility, Paul.L?

Whatever the cause, “they” seem undoubtedly to be a major danger. I’m still perplexed by how many are dangerous. We all agree that certain extremists are dangerous. Most of us agree that genuinely reasonable and peace-loving Muslims like Waleed Ally would be a great neighbour. What about the middle group, which presumably contains most Muslims? Where do they stand? How easily manipulated are they? This is what I’d like to have a better handle on. Any illumination welcome.

(Note to the socialists: I'm not saying Islam is the only problem in town, just a problem.)

Pax,

It's good to laugh!

Well done Froggie lad!

Rache
Once again the soft left brings up the furphy about the victim being just as dead. Tell that to our legal system. Ask them if they see all deaths as equal. Is someone who runs over a pedestrian who steps in front of their car as culpable as someone who stabs their wife twenty times?

It is arrant nonsense to suggest the equivalence of all death. And it is typical of the apologists of the left to try and defend the human-bombs and head-hackers.

Rache > “You may also be interested to know that the majority of all recorded terrorist incidents between 1968 and 2008 have come from seperatist/political groups and not religious ones.”

What? There have been terrorist attacks in countries including Sudan and Nigeria, Kenya and Tanzania, across the whole of the middle east, Britain, France, Spain, Netherlands, Denmark, Germany, through Former soviet republics like Chechnya, South Ossetia, Georgia and Azerbaijan, Afghanistan, In Asia, India, Pakistan, the Phillipines, Indonesia, Malaysia and more recently in Canada, the US and Australia.

All of those attacks have nothing to do with a pan-Islamic movement? They are all separatist nationalists are they? The fact that a significant number of these people are named Muhammad is irrelevant is it? How about this list? See any similarities or points of common interest?

- Abu Sayyaf means Father of the swordswith also known as Islamic Movement".
- Ansar al-Islam means "Supporters of Islam."
- Al-Qaeda The base AKA Islamic Army for the Liberation of the Holy Places,
- Asbat al-Ansar "the League of the Followers."
- Eastern Turkestan Islamic Movement
- Egyptian Islamic Jihad
- Fatah al-Islam
- Hamas – means Islamic Resistance Movement
- Harakat ul-Mujahidin
- Hezbollah – means Party of Allah
- Hizbul Mujahideen
- Islamic Movement of Uzbekistan
- Jemaah Islamiyah
- Lashkar-e-Jhangvi means Army of Jhang
- Lashkar-e-Toiba – means Army of the Pure
- Moroccan Islamic Combatant Group -
- Palestinian Islamic Jihad
- Rajah Solaiman Movement
- Sipah-e-Sahaba now Millat-e-Islamia Pakistan
- Takfir wal-Hijra – means Excommunication and Exodus
- Taliban – Students (of the Koran)