RObert,
I might save that link till later (never know when I’ll need it most) or you can snatch it and run away with it for your entertainment, lol.

“…then when does any discussion that touches on abortion in any form avoid becoming yet another discussion about the wider issues.”
Fair enough, you’re right – perhaps I was a bit too focused on the drug itself and became frustrated when some people didn’t touch the issue about the drug at all, totally ignored it. Hope nobody took too much offense!

Robert E,
I'm glad that your novel is a popular one!

OZGIRL,
oh well we'll have to agree to disagree on the input of men in this discussion.
I’m feeling very strongly that all members of the same opinion forum should have the same rights to contribute, so I just think we’d have to disagree on that one. Never mind!

We had some points of agreement as well, not only disagreements.
We agreed on probably the most important thing: that a woman without doubt should be the one who decides on whether she is having an abortion- that the decision is hers.

Snout,
I can’t imagine anyone finding you disingenuous- you come across as very thoughtful and sensible.

Thanks to all, I found this discussion was informative and enjoyable.

Wendy,
Your wish has been fulfilled already. Today we do have men with wombs: they are called wombed-men. Abbreviated to women.

Quote, "One day I hope they find a way for the men to give birth then I will be back with bells on AS A WOMAN telling them they MUST give birth. I look forward to that. Then lets see how they handle it."

From all the above discussion obviously they do not handle it all that well, they seem to prefer abortion rather than giving life to a child.

OK, here are my initial thoughts on the Ute "R" Us device (Copyright, Worldwide Patent Pending, all rights reserved by Seeker Corporation - incorporation pending).

Backpack model in your favourite colours and styles.
This model will be favoured by those expectant perents wishing to be close to their Ute "R" Us device at all times. Extremely mobile and practical unit that is fully shock proof and allows unrestricted movement while shopping, commuting to and from work, for general office or light housework duties. This unit offers the best of both worlds - feel the weight and the kicking, but save your body and lifestyle.

Capsule/Cradle model - perfect for the home or car.
This model is for active fathers who don't feel the need to be with their Ute "R" Us device, don't need social welfare, seats on buses etc., but who may want to take their fetus on weekends away. The capsule/cradle model is a wireless network device with its own IP address anabling remote monitoring over the internet. The device can also sent SMS messages to 3 different numbers, if any of its enviromental variables reach predefined limits. Comes with rechargable 36 hour battery and car charger.

Both units guarantee you will never again have to compromise your reproductive rights, or debate cynical feminists over the internet. Just pick up your Ute "R" Us device and visit your nearest IVF clinic. Easy instructions allow anyone to implant test tube material, then perform the weekly bio topups. The capsule/cradle model will even make your Doctors appointments automatically. Guilt-free and painless birth guaranteed.

Posted by Seeker, Saturday, 15 January 2005 1:33:38 AM

Unfortunately at the time, venture capital on OLO was a little scarce. Might be worth another try though ... promise not to use Dell batteries.

Melina

Did say a drug to introduce abortion.

I guess thats why to post got off to abortion.

Phil - Who said you were a bore. There is even a touch of humour there.

Seeker Thats the whole point that people are free to do as they wish.

You see guys we have already had the vote on this issue.

Finally Ozgirl gets her answer.

I dont have kids by choice So personally I couldnt care less but I support the rights of women to have control of their own body.

My friend was forced to go through with a pregancy years ago.

She Died

Your extream lot killed her..

When I was very young I looked around me at the elderly that are neglected the aboriginal people and the animal cruelty and decided I would make my life about helping those.

That does not make me less of a person.

There are other things to do in life than change nappies. [thankgod]

I try to be nice I really do but I get so angry with these nut cases telling women what to do.

Open your eyes and see the suffering of starving and unwanted kids world wide.

I know I annoy the other posters when I mention Animal cruelty but honestly you anoy me going on about something less than the size of a grain of rice while the church REMAINS silent on animal cruelty.

Yeh it IS relavant!

The fact you dont get that is your shame.> AND THE CHURCHES.

We will say when how IF? and we decide to have kids.

Ozgirls is right its just not comfortable speaking of this with men.

You know several women have told you guys that before on this post so why dont you respect their wishes?
Is it because you feel Men are superior to women.
I beleive so.

Correct me if I am wrong guys but I bet you are against birth control such as the pill or any form of birth control> Arnt You?

Wendy,

"You know several women have told you guys that before on this post so why dont you respect their wishes?
Is it because you feel Men are superior to women."

If several farmers ask you to stop talking about animal crulety do you feel that you should respect their wishes and shut up about it or do you take the view that the issue is not just about the farmers feelings.

Whilst I disagree with the no-choice mob I think that they see the issue in a similar manner to the way you see the animal crulety issue. To most of them that grain of rice is a human being with a soul (given by their god) which they think needs protection and a chance to be born. When we deny those saying things we don't like the opportunity to have a voice we are heading down a dangerous track. Substitute the words "animal cruelty" for "abortion" and you should get the picture.

For most of us it's not about men feeling superior, rather we are part of the human race and the community and what happens in the community impacts on all of us. The use or otherwise of this particular drug should be a matter for health regulators, the woman involved and her doctor. The public policy issues surrounding abortion and parental responsibility if the pregnancy proceeds is a matter for all of us.

R0bert

Hello Robert

You can hardley compaire farming of animals that are here with a ladies right to either use her own body or not to reproduce now can you.
I am not telling farmers what to do in their bedroom.

This is not about the rights of parents either.

Its about womens choice if they wish to become a mother.

I know you are trying to be fair to everybody.
I get that.
I appreciate that.

However these guys wont except that women have the right to choose as they are the ones that have to carry a full term pregancy and change their whole lives.

As far as a grain of rice having a soul we are not alive until we are born.

Give me a break.

Still I hear you saying well they beleive they are doing the right thing preaching to us women.

I get that Robert and Thanks for your thoughts.
So what do you think ?.

Do you think a women should have the right to say what happens to her own personal body and life?

Or do you think we should be under the thumb of these godly ones protecting the souls of a grain of rice?

Or do you think women should make up our own minds which was my point in the first place.

Still reckon its NOT a mans topic because we are not talking about raising kids but birth control.

Over to you.