Boaz_David (and Davo?)
you just can't help it, can you? Wherever some comment on Islam appears, you must jump in and criticise or demonize the faith. Nowhere do I see the Islamic or other faiths trashing your beliefs in these posts. In fact, in most cases they preach tolerance and co-existence. Seems you have a little ‘Independence Day’ in you - ‘there can be no co-existence!’, For a proponent of a faith you claim is the source of love, reason and compassion, you have shown very little.

Moreover, don’t try the ‘truth of the way’ with this argument. As has been discussed numerous times in other posts, there is no evidence of your truth compared to anyone else’s. I think it safe to say your own insecurity has driven you to shout loud and strong your position, in order to assure yourself of your rightness.

Why isn’t it possible, as both Fellow_Human and Odysseus imply that you can believe as you will and perhaps convince others through your acts, not your shouting? Actions hold more weight than words and the louder you shout the more the insecurity shows.

And I’d really like you, as a devout Christian, to explain the churches roles (even inaction is a role) in the horrors of WW2 and Bosnia (modern atrocities). If you can do this successfully, I may be persuaded to listen a little longer.

JustDan

Apparently, in the slave owning confederacy of 19th century America, Christian ministers adapted the marriage vows to suit slavery -which they, and the Bible, of course, fully supported. Marriage vows for black slaves stated "Till death or distance do part." Because, of course, their owners could sell husband or wife separately at any time. So much for what God has joined together, eh?
Another example of Christians being no better and no worse than the proponents of any other faith or philosophy. I, like some other posters, am heartily sick of the "my religion's better than yours", position altogether.

I know a family who, due to one partner having a muslim name, (but to make it interesting to people like Boaz, is blue eyed and white skinned) and with a christian blonde wife - is really reluctant to travel overseas to visit family. All due to the 'anti terror' laws and those of boaz's ilk. Both parents are well paid high earning and involved in the community - yet, are afraid to travel due to their names. What has this country become ?

Slavery exists today enaj, it has been renamed 'multiculturalism' (your little sweetheart, I'd imagine?). Big business propelled slavery, just like it is propelling 'multiculturalism'. Makes me want to go and listen to that song 'history repeating'.

Back to the ever exotic islam. I feel bad about being white too (NOT). It appears Islam becomes radicalised when it comes into contact with a secularised western democracy. Life in Hamburg was decisive turning point in the life of Mohammed Atta for example. He became more radicalised there than back home in Egypt. Probably the crude sex and smut that exists in that city did'nt do it for him,(it doesn't do anything for me either). But demographics is set to produce Eurabia, goodbye secular, freeedom loving Europe!

AND, what kind of people are posting comments on these forums? The only person giving a different point of view is BOAZ_david, the rest are just part of some monotonous, self deprecating clique. There is a song called "I hate myself and I want to die" by Nirvana (whose lead singer killed himself), would you all like a copy?

Davo,

Again read my posting to Boaz.
Your story on Mohamed Atta in Germany 'hating society' why didn't he blow up Germans then? Was Timothy Mc Veigh 's name mohamed McVeigh?
Was Martin Bryant called Ali Bryant?

You keep forgetting that BinLaden and Islamist terror have been blowing up muslims since 1920...Bin Laden and Al Zawahiry have arrest and death sentences against them in few muslim countries (including Egypt). Ironically then in 1996, Zawahiry was living between London and Switzerland. So technically some European cities were "harbouring terrorism" even Taliban was received in a formal visit in the US in 1998.

The US position on the terror in the middle east was: as long as they are killing other muslims or Russians...that only changed after Sep 11. The same goes for "stability above democracy" in Middle East (believe it or not there was democracies there in the fifties under the British Empire). Single party ruling (ie Dictators) is a proud produce of the US foreign policy.

Self hating and society hating could happen in religion and non religions alike..It have psychological influences.

AK

Dan,
I am using the same available evidence from the same types of sources for both Islam and Christianity. If you dont work with those sources, you work with nothing other than your imagination. As yet, I have not actually added 'my opinions' to the basic raw data. So if you don't have a better contribution, please refrain from criticism. Its not 'my way or the highway', its 'Christs way, or Islams way'. When I begin to add extraneous material which is NOT recognized by both faiths as legitimate sources, you are more than welcome to rip into my points.

ENAJ "I" am a slave, in one of the Old Testament senses, I am working predominantly for the COMMONWEALTH BANK, my slave master. Most of my year, is devoted to repaying DEBT. The use of scripture to justify 18th century version of slavery was as abominable as it was selective. We both know this, so unless your prepared to have a full and comprehensive 'slavery in the ancient near east' debate, please refrain from time wasting jibes. Unless you recognize God in your life, then whether slavery exists or not is purely a matter for your own concience, we both know that without God there IS no universally applicable foundation for morality in spite of the persistant claims to the contrary from humanisticly (and sentimentally) oriented people.

One thing I do know, the impact of the gospel of Christ on slave owning indegenous people is awesomely wonderful. My wife being a member of a former slave owning family. Now, I goto her area, the former slaves have land, buffaloes, indepenance and freedom, given by the former slave owners. I have a pic of my wifes grandma, with one of her former slaves, arm in arm, just like family. I have little time for the trite and shallow claims like yours, when you havent had any first hand experience most likely.

ASH
see my next post, special for you :)