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The Forum > Article Comments > Book review: God 'under' Howard - a different perspective > Comments

Book review: God 'under' Howard - a different perspective : Comments

By Gavin Mooney, published 6/4/2005

Gavin Mooney argues Marion Maddox's book 'God under Howard' is well researched and draws frightening conclusions.

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Bozzie I guess some of us are being a bit parnoid, but the abortion issue got me going. The thought of having this made illegal because some people believe that a fertilized egg is a human life, is scary when you realise how bad the backyard abortions were prior to this procedure becoming legal.

Going back to divorce that requires 'fault' to be allocated is another potential 'evil' (I don't think Marion ever suggested that they were evil? surely evil is the provence of the religious). This caused a lot of anguish and pain for people, including children.

What about banning the teaching of evolution in state schools? That is something that some of the Religous right would like to see happen. There are lots more freedoms that these people would like to take away.

I think you just need to look to the US to see the problems that some of us worry about if the Religous right get political power.
Posted by Mollydukes, Sunday, 10 April 2005 6:31:37 PM
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Molly, its interesting to note that the pain and suffering NOW from 'quickie divorce' is far more rampant as I see, that it was before. I don't think you have surveyed many young people who would choose MUCH more to be in a fiery family than to see his/her parents split up and destroy the family unit.

The 'religious right' would prefer that Evolution is taught as THEORY and that Creation/Intelligent design is taught as ANOTHER theory. Got it ? good. Don't go on about 'banning evolution' again please, -too sweeping and general.

You persist in imposing your view that a conceived child is 'nothing more than' a fertilized egg ! See ? not nice is it when ur accused of 'imposing'.... But the fact is, we have different views on the matter and the only way to decide it is by legislation. We happen to be of the view that there are many better options in most cases than to murder a newly conceived infant, and carrying a responsiblity to term and giving joy to childless couples remains a very good option.

CAN we please get away from the idea that all religous people are memebers of some monolithic 'religious right' !

Its not like that. Not everyone is a 'Fred Phelps-"godhatesfags.com" type.

Col, small groups can change the destiny of a country. If a close election hangs on the outcome of ONE seat, it will determine who is PM, etc etc.... and Yes, your point about 'if its not too radical' is noted.

Garra.. there u go, 'if its not secular humanist its 'evil' ' seems to be the mantra you are currently chanting before the mirror each morning. Well, secular humanism went bankrupt decades ago, they just havent caught up with it yet :) So, I'll do a Neitche, and declare "Secular Humanism is dead".... It never had, has not now and never will have a valid foundation, and I have the impression that most SH's live somehwere between fantasyland and Disneyworld. If you wish to persue that in a debate kinda way, I'll accomodate.
Posted by BOAZ_David, Sunday, 10 April 2005 8:05:39 PM
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No, "BOAZ-David", not "evil". Rather it has no place in government. Read the Australian constitution.
Posted by garra, Sunday, 10 April 2005 8:31:05 PM
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Firstly, to David Boaz - interesting point re divorce, my experience with friends etc has been the reverse. The ones who've grown up in families which became a farce a long time ago are a lot less stable and self-confident than the ones whose parents acknowledged they couldn't get along and divorced. In many cases where this decision is made early enough, there isn't much hostility and the parents, living apart, can rediscover the friendship they had before marriage. Also, let's distinguish here between Christians and the Christian Right. The latter do not behave in line with their own scripture, they run around judging people and trying to ban things. Just look what they have achieved and are achieving in the US if you don't believe me.

Secondly, to those who asked me about the left, you only need to look at the continuing increase of the Green vote and the influence of the Labor Left in internal Labor politics both state and federal. It's interesting that in almost every state election, the Greens have become the only minor party. The Left forced the Labor party to abandon its earlier decision to support the Iraq war, and even Beazley has had to change his rhetoric. Although people are still voting for Liberal on economic issues, you'll find the same people share a surprising amount of room on social issues with the Left - especially (basic) gay rights, abortion, refugees, the war in Iraq, separation of church and state, etc. This means that the Liberal party can proceed with its economic plans but not their social ones as they would lose votes with the latter.
Posted by OrderInChaos, Monday, 11 April 2005 3:27:41 AM
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Regardless of the assertion that secular humanism is dead, I think you'll find it operates in most levels of government, industry, education, science and so on in Australia quite well. There are some countries where secular humanism has been crushed (Iran, Saudi Arabia and Mauritania come to mind) but these are usually considered places to avoid. Actually, even in Iran the younger generation are growing tired of prescriptive religious dogma forced on them at every turn.

If, as is happening in the US, Christian fundamentalists want to teach creationism alongside evolution as a theory, I would be extremely concerned. Evolution is generally accepted by reputable scientists as the process of how life began and progressed on this planet. Creationism is a religious belief at odds with scientific learning.

Also, if you going to teach creationism in science classrooms why not witchcraft? Or levitation? Science teaching in Australia would become a joke.
Posted by DavidJS, Monday, 11 April 2005 9:30:16 AM
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Creationism is a mockery of clear thinking and logical thought, as Davidjs says, may as well teach witchcraft. Creationism is not a theory it is a faith no evidence for it.

Anyway, I am definitely going to read 'God under howard' - he HAS lied and reneged on so much and to have it all put into printed form is a step towards accountable democracy.

Wot alot of religious folk don't understand is that Howard is using Christianity just like he has used racism and economic insecurity to gain votes - he is demonstrably amoral - any consideration of his track record will reveal this. Howard is ultimately a professional politician - he is only concerned about being elected and re elected and he is very good at that. If he really cared about the infrastructure of this nation he would be using the huge surplus he has garnered to put back into Australia, instead he is offering further tax cuts to high income earners.

Go Marion Maddox - U Rock!
Posted by Xena, Monday, 11 April 2005 11:23:08 AM
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