>>Tell me, are you pro-abortion or pro-unmarried-women-having-children or both? Because you're obviously pro-sex-outside-of-marriage, which means you have to be one or the other.<<

Because you can't be pro-contraception? I'm guessing you're a Catholic Mr Anderson.

Cheers,

Tony

*Maybe our grandparents weren't so dumb...*

Many of our grandpartents lived in fear and misery, Mr Anderson.
I've had plenty of old people confess to me, that they wish that
they had their lives over again. They had married the wrong person
for instance, then out of a sense of duty, been miserable for
decades, due to society pressure. etc.

Personally I am for choice, less suffering, more happy people and
for keeping the busybodies of the Vatican out of decisions about
my life and out of the lives of those who don't want them interfering.
Let them stick to preaching to their flocks

@John Forster
"you've done the typical pro-abortion thing by seeing 40 Days for Life as being an organisation that is opposed to abortion and have lumped 40 Days in with all other organisations of the same ilk". So your in favor of abortion then?

A rose by any other name.... I don't care what your website says 40dfl does, I know what I have seen. The usual scene outside Preterm in Sydney consists of a small group of people standing next to a banner, standing around chatting to each other, while others, you may call them "sidewalk counsellors", are scattered up & down the street, covering all approaches to the clinic entrance and positioning their posters outside the clinic's door. Are you saying these people are ring-ins?

And if you are not trying to intimidate women by your mass presence, why are you praying on street corners outside clinics? Why not pray for 40 days in church? Why not spend 40 days outside parliament? You would increase your puplic exposure, if thats really what your after.

>>The idea of 40 Days for Life is exactly what the tag line says: "Pray to end abortion." The operative word there is 'pray'. It's not "Protest to end abortion" or "Harass to end abortion" or "Intimidate to end abortion".<<

Either you rely on a very different definition of prayer than most of us or you're just telling fibs - not a good idea when the marvel that is the interweb facilitates such easy investigation of your claims.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DK2dxclzVtc

I know a lot of Christians - I was raised Catholic myself although I'm reformed these days. In my experience the only time Christians pray aloud are during religious services: usually Mass although there are other occasions like ANZAC Day services. And my parents say grace before dinner. But usually Christians just pray quietly and privately in their own head which is reasonable because God knows what you're thinking even if you don't speak it aloud.

And prayer is a conversation with God and nobody else. So I don't really understand what marching around abortion clinics waving placards and blowing horns has to do with praying. The nice thing about prayer is that you can do it any time any where and God will hear it because He is omniscient - that doesn't guarantee He'll do anything about it because He moves in mysterious ways.

You don't have to stand outside in the elements day in day out to pray to end abortion when prayer can be so easily multi-tasked with other activities. All those good Christians could be at home looking after the foster children they've taken in and the starving orphans they've adopted because they care so much about the children and still pray to end abortion. But I bet they won't do that because it isn't just about prayer is it?

Cheers,

Tony

Jon J. my embryology textbook, “Before we are born: essentials of embryology and birth defects”, by Moore and Persaud, says that a zygote is the beginning of a new human being. There is no mention of “potential human being”. A zygote is a member of the human species: it has the full human genome and is a living organism. What species do you think it belongs to?

A zygote has the potential to become a morula, which has potential to implant and continue as an embryo (up to 8 weeks) and subsequently the potential to become a fetus (human from 8 week stage), which has potential to grow and be born (baby human), which has the potential to grow and become a human adult. This is a continuum that all started at conception. No one worries about sperm or ova or moles or skin cells dying: these cells are part of a living human, not distinct organisms in their own right. Your other examples are ridiculous nonsense, but thanks for the laugh.

If, by cloning, you change a human cell (say a skin cell) into an embryo, then you have created a new human life; that may indeed grow along all stages of human development. The zygote formed is no longer a skin cell from a human, but is transformed into a new human organism that is distinct, self-contained and alive.

Also, a fertilized acorn seed is the start of an oak tree. The seed and the tree are in the same species and have the same genetic structure and DNA. Obviously the seed is not a tree, like a baby or fetus is not an adult. The tree to the fertilized seed is much like an adult to a zygote, but genetically the smaller forms have the same DNA as the bigger forms: thus they are the same type of organism or being, just at different stages of their lives. I’m not sure what you are trying to say with that example, since you scientifically helped the case for the humanity of the zygote.

*and is a living organism*

Indeed RichG, the zygote is an organism with potential. But it is not
a person. A sperm is an organsim with potential. A human egg has
potential. But none of them are people, just beings with potential.

An organism does not think or feel, it has no human brain. Giving
it some kind of magical powers or reverence is nothing but an
invention of the Catholic Church.

Personally I'd prefer to focus on thinking, feeling people already
born and suffering, rather than become hysterical about Catholic
dogma and organisms.

As Charles Darwin noted, far more beings of any species will be created, then can ever survive. He was correct and anything else
is wishful thinking.